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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Spatzimaus" data-source="post: 1111837" data-attributes="member: 3051">Like Tywyll said, I'd never allow mental stat penalties that large.  They also don't really balance; look at a Half-Orc.  +2 STR balances -2 INT, -2 CHA for the simple reason that a melee combatant gets far more benefit out of the physical increase than he loses from the mentals.  By giving giant penalties to INT and WIS, you make an almost un-roleplayable character who still is just as effective in melee combat.  I'd never allow the ECL to lower just for that.Anyway, the SS Half-Ogre is fine either at ECL+2, or ECL+1 with 2 levels of Giant, like Technik4 said.  There are plenty of threads on this board about why it's broken at a simple +1.  No matter how you try to balance it, making a race with 10' reach and a huge STR is just asking for trouble, especially with all the other bonuses they get.  Besides, Ogres themselves only have -4 INT and no WIS penalty, so why should their halfbreeds have such large penalties?Regardless, I don't use the SS Half-Ogre either, IMC we use an ECL0 variant we came up with on these boards about two years ago.  Instead of being a Large race, it's a Medium race with some Large characteristics in the same way that Dwarves are Medium with some Small characteristics (like movement rate and racial bonuses).  We've never had a problem with it in our campaigns, and it makes a nice counterpoint to the wimpy little magic-using races.  If you can't find the thread on these boards, I can probably find a writeup of it.</blockquote>

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