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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Wulf Ratbane" data-source="post: 287656" data-attributes="member: 94">In the core rules I can:Spend 160 XP to gain a semi-permanent +20 to a skill.Spend 2000 XP to gain a semi-permanent +5 deflection bonus to AC.Spend 1200 XP to gain a semi-permanent SR rating of 15!All of the above are already limited by caster level, spell-list access, and available magic item slots (two rings, one pair of boots, etc.).Item Creation is further balanced as a perk of membership to spellcasting classes. And they require a feat, as we said before. There's nothing in the core rules that allows the straight expenditure of XP to gain abilities.Guess what, none of these raises my CR a bit. No, but as I said above, the number of magic items available to an NPC (or PC) that is consistent with the CR system HAS been spelled out. Guidelines exist.Gaining levels is essentially trading XP for abilities, BAB, base saves, and special abilities. The XP chart for gaining school abilities mirrors this progression.Not on a piece-meal basis, no it is not. That's a gross oversimplification. D&D is specifically not a classless system where you can buy abilities a la carte. Monte (or Sean, can't recall) covered the thinking behind this some time ago.You don't trade XP for abilities. Your XP simply defines your level: Look at XP, cross-reference chart. That's the end of XP's involvement in the equation.XP *is* the balancing mechanism in 3e, that's why there is now a standard progression chart, which differs from past editions. It is far more accurate to say that class and level are the balancing mechanism. Each class comes with a PACKAGE of abilities. You don't get to cherry pick. You don't buy hit dice with xp, you don't buy BAB, you don't buy skills, you don't buy feats. Now, I'm not saying it's not possible to do that, but I trust Monte and the original design team more than I trust Mongoose, FFG, or even myself. You could make a system where you spend XP a la carte, and you could balance the whole thing-- but you can't take an XP/buy system out of context and throw it into a carefully balanced class/level system and expect it to work.This is an interesting discussion and I'd like to hear more about why you think XP is not used to balance character ability in the d20 System. I have a little exercise I like to do when I design called, "Extrapolate to Absurdity."When you simply subtract XP without any accounting of where it has gone, and then take this process and extrapolate to absurdity, you can end up with an infinite amount of XP. Meet my 10th level wizard who has spent 1000 xp... My 10th level wizard who has spent 100,000 xp... My 10th level wizard who has spent one billion XP!You can't do that with feats. You can't "spend" XP to gain a feat. If you are 10th level, based on your race and class, you have a FINITE number of feats. You can't break this limiting, balancing factor. You can't.(I mention feats because they are the most digestible way of defining a class ability, but it holds for BAB, skills, etc.)Yes, I know that in my above example, we could potentially extrapolate to absurdity with magic items as well. That is precisely why the DM needs to reference DMG p. 43 for PC's, and p.47 for NPCs. Item creation and XP expenditure is an exception to the rule; it's been taken into account and guidelines are provided. By following the rules given there I know that any given PC/NPC of a given class and level will be CR balanced in the d20 system.By the way, I hope you don't think I was attacking S&S, there's lots to love in there-- I just don't care for XP expenditure as a balancing mechanism. Wulf</blockquote>

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