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<blockquote data-quote="Nail" data-source="post: 3428759" data-attributes="member: 224">You've mis-understood the analysis.&nbsp; Using one opponent was for comparison purposes.&nbsp; The results would be the same (only more complicated) against other scenarios: wolf-pack tactics, swarm tactics, teamwork v.s loner, etc.&nbsp; Just like in the simplified scenario, the Dex monk does far more poorly than the Str Mnk.Which Mnk build does more damage more reliably? &nbsp; The one I posted (or &quot;the Str Mnk&quot; <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile&nbsp; &nbsp; :)"&nbsp; data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />).Which Mnk will survive longer in a fight? Both have about the same survivability.&nbsp; (Con is easily switched in the Str Mnk build; that's not the defining char.)Which Mnk will be more fun to play? &nbsp; YMMV.&nbsp; I've often found that those PCs that do less damage in fights tend to be less fun for lots of different types of players (not just me).The numbers disagree with you.&nbsp; And if we took Darklone's suggestion, we could ditch Impr. Grapple for Weapon Focus and make the difference +2.Tumbling negates AoOs, so no need for Mobility.&nbsp; And both Mnks have tumble.Over 4 rounds against a BBEG (assume AC 16), the Str Mnk does 32.1 hp dam, the Dex Mnk does 15.4 hp dam.Put bluntly: The Str Mnk does over twice the damage of the Dex Mnk.&nbsp; Explain how that is not significant.&nbsp;&nbsp; <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f600.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":D" title="Big grin&nbsp; &nbsp; :D"&nbsp; data-smilie="8"data-shortname=":D" /> &nbsp;You and I agree here!&nbsp;&nbsp; <img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/smilies/laugh.png"&nbsp; class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":lol:" title="Laughing&nbsp; &nbsp; :lol:" data-shortname=":lol:" /> Your Dex Mnk has no &quot;mental abilities&quot;, and only 1 &quot;social ability&quot;: Sense Motive.&nbsp; Any other difference between the two Mnks in the &quot;mental ability&quot; department is completely role-play.&nbsp; And that's not &quot;computer game&quot; stuff, is it?&nbsp;&nbsp; <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink&nbsp; &nbsp; ;)"&nbsp; data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" /> It seems like you are saying: &quot;If you want to play a half-orc, you should just play CRPGs!&quot;</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Nail, post: 3428759, member: 224"] You've mis-understood the analysis. Using one opponent was for comparison purposes. The results would be the same (only more complicated) against other scenarios: wolf-pack tactics, swarm tactics, teamwork v.s loner, etc. Just like in the simplified scenario, the Dex monk does far more poorly than the Str Mnk. [I]Which Mnk build does more damage more reliably? [/I] The one I posted (or "the Str Mnk" :)). [I]Which Mnk will survive longer in a fight? [/I] Both have about the same survivability. (Con is easily switched in the Str Mnk build; that's not the defining char.) [I]Which Mnk will be more fun to play? [/I] YMMV. I've often found that those PCs that do less damage in fights tend to be less fun for lots of different types of players (not just me). The numbers disagree with you. And if we took Darklone's suggestion, we could ditch Impr. Grapple for Weapon Focus and make the difference +2. Tumbling negates AoOs, so no need for Mobility. And both Mnks have tumble. Over 4 rounds against a BBEG (assume AC 16), the Str Mnk does 32.1 hp dam, the Dex Mnk does 15.4 hp dam. Put bluntly: The Str Mnk does [b]over twice[/b] the damage of the Dex Mnk. Explain how that is not significant. :D You and I agree here! :lol: Your Dex Mnk has no "mental abilities", and only 1 "social ability": Sense Motive. Any other difference between the two Mnks in the "mental ability" department is completely role-play. And that's not "computer game" stuff, is it? ;) It seems like you are saying: "If you want to play a half-orc, you should just play CRPGs!" [/QUOTE]

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