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Message: <blockquote data-quote="pawsplay" data-source="post: 4596428" data-attributes="member: 15538">Yet Fighters and Rogues are both Martial. Wizards and Bards (at least in 3e) are both Arcane. Your argument breaks down because although there is a narrow focus to each power source, not everything under that power source looks exactly the same. Bards don't throw fireballs, for instance. I find it difficult to consider Barbarians and Druids simply variations on a theme. The elemental magic of the shugenja is probably partially inspired by the Book of Five Rings by Musashi, from which Lot5R takes its name. Those books are named Earth, Water, Fire, Wind, and No-thing. Traditional Chinese medicine usually posits five elements, rather than four, but the idea of elemental forces and natural balance are a part of Chinese medicine, martial arts, geomancy, feng shui, etc. I don't see how there is a conceptual problem with ki, on the one hand, empowering a fist to break solid stone, and on the other, being used to manipulate elemental fire or wind. Martial arts cinema and mythology is full of elemental effects, including hurling fire, wind, "iron" body techniques, and so forth. Maybe it is difficult for you to visualize what I am talking about, but I don't see any obstacle to a ki-based elementalist, just as there are wizards, psions, clerics, and druids who all influence the elements.Saying "That is magic, no ki" is just a personal prejudice. Ki can be used for magic. I don't know that 4e will take that direction, but it seems like a natural fit to me. If the monk's abiliities were not overtly supernatural, the monk would just be Martial.</blockquote>

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