Reply to thread

Message

<blockquote data-quote="Deset Gled" data-source="post: 5283674" data-attributes="member: 7808">[DEBATE]Rules POV:1.&nbsp; Monks can take INA.&nbsp; Their unarmed strike counts as a natural weapons for spells and effects, and feats are effects.2.&nbsp; Monks cannot take INA.&nbsp; Their unarmed strike counts as a natural weapons for spells and effects, and feats are not effects.&nbsp; (Many secondary sources are incorrect per the Primary Source rule.)3.&nbsp; Monks cannot take INA.&nbsp; Their unarmed strike counts as a natural weapons for spells and effects.&nbsp; Feats are effects, but their prerequisites are not.&nbsp; (Many secondary sources are incorrect per the Primary Source rule.)4.&nbsp; Monks can take INA.&nbsp; The primary source is ambiguous, and other sources clarify that they can.5.&nbsp; Monks can take INA.&nbsp; The Players Handbook 2 errata states &quot;Improved Natural Attack cannot be attained until 6th level for a monk&quot;, implicitly stating that INA can be taken once the BAB prereq is met.&nbsp; Since this is an official errata document, it overrides the Primary Source.Balance POV:A.&nbsp; Monks can take INA.&nbsp; The monk is underpowered, and this feat helps balance them.B.&nbsp; Monks cannot take INA.&nbsp; INA is too powerful for a feat.&nbsp; Other sources provide better alternatives.Intent POV:I.&nbsp; Monks cannot take INA.&nbsp; INA was intended for monsters only.&nbsp; (Many secondary sources were written by authors that did not follow the original intent.)II.&nbsp; Monks can take INA.&nbsp; INA was intended to improve any attack made without weapons.[/DEBATE]I find #5 is the hardest to argue with.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Deset Gled, post: 5283674, member: 7808"] [DEBATE] Rules POV: 1. Monks can take INA. Their unarmed strike counts as a natural weapons for spells and effects, and feats are effects. 2. Monks cannot take INA. Their unarmed strike counts as a natural weapons for spells and effects, and feats are not effects. (Many secondary sources are incorrect per the Primary Source rule.) 3. Monks cannot take INA. Their unarmed strike counts as a natural weapons for spells and effects. Feats are effects, but their prerequisites are not. (Many secondary sources are incorrect per the Primary Source rule.) 4. Monks can take INA. The primary source is ambiguous, and other sources clarify that they can. 5. Monks can take INA. The Players Handbook 2 errata states "Improved Natural Attack cannot be attained until 6th level for a monk", implicitly stating that INA can be taken once the BAB prereq is met. Since this is an official errata document, it overrides the Primary Source. Balance POV: A. Monks can take INA. The monk is underpowered, and this feat helps balance them. B. Monks cannot take INA. INA is too powerful for a feat. Other sources provide better alternatives. Intent POV: I. Monks cannot take INA. INA was intended for monsters only. (Many secondary sources were written by authors that did not follow the original intent.) II. Monks can take INA. INA was intended to improve any attack made without weapons. [/DEBATE] I find #5 is the hardest to argue with. [/QUOTE]

Verification