Reply to thread

Message

<blockquote data-quote="Ashrym" data-source="post: 8049265" data-attributes="member: 6750235">Not a fan of the argument.&nbsp; Using eldritch blast plus agonizing blast plus hex as the baseline is too high a baseline, and DPR wouldn't be everything even if there were a significant gap.If that's the baseline most classes struggle with damage without relying on feat support.Mobility sucks because horse was clearly reaching.Comparing subclasses to base classes is even less apples to oranges than monks to x class.Monks can off-tank but players don't like to because it impacts DPR, which isn't everything. To me, that's versatility in changing the role a bit as needed.As mentioned, other classes don't have the higher AC and weapon damage from a two hander.&nbsp; That's a Schrodinger argument.MAD does hit them.&nbsp; They are very reliant on both WIS and DEX, but at least both offer a lot of benefits.I don't think any class actually sucks. Some can be awkward in implemention but still effective.&nbsp; Just not necessarily effective the way a player might want (DPR plus extras)They should now.&nbsp; Praise-poets/singers would be a typical RP style for a bard.Bards are prominent in real world history and mythology, and represented in pop culture.&nbsp; I have no issues justifying that existence. ;-)It's inherent in proficiency access and ability score development.&nbsp; 5e is based on an unmodified check when rolling is necessary. The description for setting DC's goes over ability score and proficiency hitting moderate / hard. Needing stacking extra bonuses is a different model from past editions.It's always easier to justify a short rest over a long rest.&nbsp; IME, lack of short rests because a long rest gets taken instead isn't an issue.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Ashrym, post: 8049265, member: 6750235"] Not a fan of the argument. Using eldritch blast plus agonizing blast plus hex as the baseline is too high a baseline, and DPR wouldn't be everything even if there were a significant gap. If that's the baseline most classes struggle with damage without relying on feat support. Mobility sucks because horse was clearly reaching. Comparing subclasses to base classes is even less apples to oranges than monks to x class. Monks can off-tank but players don't like to because it impacts DPR, which isn't everything. To me, that's versatility in changing the role a bit as needed. As mentioned, other classes don't have the higher AC and weapon damage from a two hander. That's a Schrodinger argument. MAD does hit them. They are very reliant on both WIS and DEX, but at least both offer a lot of benefits. I don't think any class actually sucks. Some can be awkward in implemention but still effective. Just not necessarily effective the way a player might want (DPR plus extras) They should now. Praise-poets/singers would be a typical RP style for a bard. Bards are prominent in real world history and mythology, and represented in pop culture. I have no issues justifying that existence. ;-) It's inherent in proficiency access and ability score development. 5e is based on an unmodified check when rolling is necessary. The description for setting DC's goes over ability score and proficiency hitting moderate / hard. Needing stacking extra bonuses is a different model from past editions. It's always easier to justify a short rest over a long rest. IME, lack of short rests because a long rest gets taken instead isn't an issue. [/QUOTE]

Verification