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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Chaosmancer" data-source="post: 8050748" data-attributes="member: 6801228">Did you just ignore the parenthetical where I said "because I've done that math already"? Because, you know what you just did by changing all those numbers to 16's? Reduced everything by the same amount. All of that damage I did at +4 got reduced by the exact same amount. I also admitted that the Fighter likely has a better con. HP was never once a consideration for me. Yes, Figher has better Hp. Not contesting that. It was the other aspects I was contesting.So, your objection ignored everything else I did, and made no impact on my analysis... congrats?The big problem I have with this concept of "average con score" is that it assumes that either A) Monk players are stupid or B) Everything is close to the average. A stupid, easy example.The Monk player has two creatures they can attack. The Archmage (CR 12) or the Heavily Armored and Otherworldy general of the Hells, the Eryines (CR 12).Which one do they stun? Without even knowing there stats, you pick the Archmage. They are more likely to fail the save (+1 Con save) while the Eriynes is likely to succeed (+8 Con save) Looking at the average is assuming the Monk doesn't try and pick their targets intelligently, and if they do, then it matters a lot more which monster they are fighting than what the average score is.sighBut making the argument that poison is a waste of time and a worthless damage type because everything is immune to it is also false. There are creatures that are not immune to poison, and we can't forget that.Yes, Stunning Strike isn't as useful against a massive brute. But, every class that does saves has pretty close to the monk's numbers, and some of the most dangerous enemies aren't brutes. Meaning the enemies the monk can stun reliably, are more dangerous, and even against brutes, they have about a 50/50 shot. Which is not terrible for something that is a rider on their normal actions and bonus actions.</blockquote>

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