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<blockquote data-quote="pemerton" data-source="post: 6136495" data-attributes="member: 42582"><p>You could, sure, but the MM and MM2 don't. Here, side by side, are their descriptions of demons, daemons, and devils:</p><p></p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Demons are chaotic and evil; the smarter and stronger rule those of their kind who are weaker and less intelligent<br /> <br /> </li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">There is a large number of daemon races, each race dominated by its strongest and most intelligent member. Weaker daemons are usually at the beck and call of stronger members of their race, while the strongest daemon, the oinodaemon, rules all<br /> <br /> </li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Devils follow a definite order, a chain of command, which they dare not break for fear of the arch-devils. Still, there is great rivalry, even open antagonism</li> </ul><p></p><p>The only difference between demons and daemons, as described, is that the latter have a single strongest master (the oinodaemon). Whereas devils are quite different, having a definite order including a chain of command.</p><p></p><p>I'm sure it is, but a retcon is still a retcon. There's nothing wrong with a good retcon - I'm just pointing out that it's a change. And hence that Planescape can't claim to be simply the natural development of what was presented prior to it in Gygaxian AD&D.</p><p></p><p>Although I personally don't care much for Planescape, I want to make it clear that <em>I don't think the previous paragraph is a criticism of Planescape</em>. 4e retconned stuff too - for instance, it retcons the relationship between Lolth and spiders by making her have once been a god of fate, and hence a weaver.</p><p></p><p>My point is much more modest. I wouldn't expect any future treatment of Lolth, or for that matter of spiders, to hold itself to the 4e lore. If a future version of the game doesn't want to use the Fate god explanation for why Lolth like spiders, that's fine. I take the same view towards Planescape. It was what it was. Plenty of people liked it; others didn't. But it has no special monopoloy over D&D planar lore.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="pemerton, post: 6136495, member: 42582"] You could, sure, but the MM and MM2 don't. Here, side by side, are their descriptions of demons, daemons, and devils: [list][*]Demons are chaotic and evil; the smarter and stronger rule those of their kind who are weaker and less intelligent [*]There is a large number of daemon races, each race dominated by its strongest and most intelligent member. Weaker daemons are usually at the beck and call of stronger members of their race, while the strongest daemon, the oinodaemon, rules all [*]Devils follow a definite order, a chain of command, which they dare not break for fear of the arch-devils. Still, there is great rivalry, even open antagonism[/list] The only difference between demons and daemons, as described, is that the latter have a single strongest master (the oinodaemon). Whereas devils are quite different, having a definite order including a chain of command. I'm sure it is, but a retcon is still a retcon. There's nothing wrong with a good retcon - I'm just pointing out that it's a change. And hence that Planescape can't claim to be simply the natural development of what was presented prior to it in Gygaxian AD&D. Although I personally don't care much for Planescape, I want to make it clear that [I]I don't think the previous paragraph is a criticism of Planescape[/I]. 4e retconned stuff too - for instance, it retcons the relationship between Lolth and spiders by making her have once been a god of fate, and hence a weaver. My point is much more modest. I wouldn't expect any future treatment of Lolth, or for that matter of spiders, to hold itself to the 4e lore. If a future version of the game doesn't want to use the Fate god explanation for why Lolth like spiders, that's fine. I take the same view towards Planescape. It was what it was. Plenty of people liked it; others didn't. But it has no special monopoloy over D&D planar lore. [/QUOTE]
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