Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Next
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
Twitch
YouTube
Facebook (EN Publishing)
Facebook (EN World)
Twitter
Instagram
TikTok
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
The
VOIDRUNNER'S CODEX
is LIVE! Explore new worlds, fight oppressive empires, fend off fearsome aliens, and wield deadly psionics with this comprehensive boxed set expansion for 5E and A5E!
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Monsters with spell lists is not a good sign
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Nork" data-source="post: 5920690" data-attributes="member: 59879"><p>I'm going to apologize for stomping all over you here, but I think you said something that does need a bit of stomping on. It sounds good (because who is against 'excellence'), but it is realistically a fairly pernicious trap.</p><p></p><p>The productivity tanking minutia of cross-referencing rules, building monsters out with templates, or applying character classes does massive damage to most playgroups by making life hell for the DM. It is generally bad for the game as a whole.</p><p></p><p>Average is better than 'above average' when average has four times the productivity because they implement a fast and serviceable solution to solve their task and then moves on to solve the next problem (or three) instead of piddling around gold-plating everything the work on because they want to be 'above average'.</p><p></p><p>Using easy to use low work stat blocks for 'average' monsters allows a DM to spend very little time building monsters, and thereby have more time to work on the rest of the adventure. A full system constructed of average sub-systems will stomp all over a partial system with a handful of gold-plated features. This holds true for an adventure.</p><p></p><p>Average monsters make better adventures because there is more to experience in the adventure. One snarky comment by the King's interesting daughter that makes the players laugh is worth ten times the return on a gold-plated monster in a world with a boring daughterless-king with little thought put into his personality. Average monsters make finished adventures that are ready on game night, and not a half-finished mess that is being winged through because it blew pass the deadline like a bullet train on the way to Tokyo. Average monsters make DMs continue DMing instead of being burnt out because every adventure doesn't require them to spend a colossal amount of time crunching to get it done.</p><p></p><p>Life is too short to start over-ambitious projects that never get finished.</p><p></p><p>4E monster blocks were designed that way for valid reasons. Extremely valid reasons.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Nork, post: 5920690, member: 59879"] I'm going to apologize for stomping all over you here, but I think you said something that does need a bit of stomping on. It sounds good (because who is against 'excellence'), but it is realistically a fairly pernicious trap. The productivity tanking minutia of cross-referencing rules, building monsters out with templates, or applying character classes does massive damage to most playgroups by making life hell for the DM. It is generally bad for the game as a whole. Average is better than 'above average' when average has four times the productivity because they implement a fast and serviceable solution to solve their task and then moves on to solve the next problem (or three) instead of piddling around gold-plating everything the work on because they want to be 'above average'. Using easy to use low work stat blocks for 'average' monsters allows a DM to spend very little time building monsters, and thereby have more time to work on the rest of the adventure. A full system constructed of average sub-systems will stomp all over a partial system with a handful of gold-plated features. This holds true for an adventure. Average monsters make better adventures because there is more to experience in the adventure. One snarky comment by the King's interesting daughter that makes the players laugh is worth ten times the return on a gold-plated monster in a world with a boring daughterless-king with little thought put into his personality. Average monsters make finished adventures that are ready on game night, and not a half-finished mess that is being winged through because it blew pass the deadline like a bullet train on the way to Tokyo. Average monsters make DMs continue DMing instead of being burnt out because every adventure doesn't require them to spend a colossal amount of time crunching to get it done. Life is too short to start over-ambitious projects that never get finished. 4E monster blocks were designed that way for valid reasons. Extremely valid reasons. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Monsters with spell lists is not a good sign
Top