Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
Monte Cook on what rules are for
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="JamesonCourage" data-source="post: 5716107" data-attributes="member: 6668292"><p>In a way. The player won't ask permission, but just because he says it, it doesn't mean his character gets to say it. That is, if a PC says "I say XYZ" and there's nothing stopping him, then he says it. However, if I know that something will stop him, whether it's him noticing something, someone ready to stop him by attacking or cutting him off, etc., then the PC does not get to say that unhindered (or possibly at all).</p><p></p><p>It's not based on "I say XYZ. Okay?" That's not what I said. I just said that I determine if that's true or not. They can (and do) say, "XYZ" (they don't say "I say" first the huge majority of the time), and most of the time there's no problem. At no point is there a "I attempt to say XYZ" unless the circumstances overtly call for it.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Yes, but it's the same scenario. Most of the time, it's "I swing my sword at the orc" and then it's an attack roll. However, just because a player says as much, it doesn't mean it happens. And, I suspect this is true of 4e, too. Any interrupt action can stop the attack, or a readied action, or sometimes spotting something. For example, it might be:</p><p>Player: "I turn and attack the orc on my right."</p><p>GM: "Roll Spot."</p><p>Player: "Okay... 22."</p><p>GM: "When you turn your attention to this specific orc, you notice the hidden marking of the allied thief guild on the orc's forearm."</p><p>Player: "Hmm, but he's attacking. Then again, we know that someone in this very group we're fighting can cast <em>Dominate</em>. Either he's enchanted, or he's a traitor, but either way I want him alive. I'll deal nonlethal damage."</p><p>GM: "You take a..."</p><p>Player: "Penalty to my attacks, yeah, I know. I'll attack anyways."</p><p>GM: "Go ahead and roll."</p><p></p><p>I doubt this situation is far off from 4e (not necessarily your group, but 4e). Thus, unless I say it's true, it doesn't happen. </p><p></p><p></p><p>Yep, this is generally true. However, if a player is acting in a very lighthearted way, and I say, "you're in a bad mood," he will almost certainly ask why. I might tell him a reason, or I might say, "you just are". Either way, I know why (and it's almost certainly magical in nature). PC mood is very intimate to a player, so I try not to override things like that.</p><p></p><p>Additionally, I've known all but one of the players for 13+ years, so I have a good grasp on what sets their PCs off most of the time, so I can say, "you're in a bad mood" with some certainty that they'll agree. If the player asks, "why?" and I say, "because you got food poisoning from that chef you've been trying to get rid of that's in a relationship with your love interest" I assume it's good enough for some players (but not for others). If, however, he says, "I'm probably a little annoyed, but my mood is fine," I might be surprised, but I'll let it go; that player knows the PC better than I do.</p><p></p><p>As far as hair styles and such go, I try to communicate generally different clothes styles, hair styles, etc. of each region, nation, or social status on the map (that is, if players are interested, or if it's dramatically abnormal or otherwise important). In my current game, you can have different amounts of status mechanically with your PC, and only the nobility are assumed to be tall, strong, attractive looking by default, due to the dietary habits, breeding, and the like. So, when one PC who was low Status said he was 5'11", I said, "that's probably too tall for your status. The average is closer to 5'4", but you theoretically be that tall. It'd just be pretty rare." He changed his height to 5'3" and we moved on (this is the player I've known for about two months now).</p><p></p><p>At any rate, yes, things get cleared before they happen in-game. That same player has two eyes of a different color once before, and when I noticed it was on his sheet, I told him to change it (there's a way to note such abnormalities mechanically, and he didn't take it). He asked if he could swap to get that mechanical "benefit", and I let him. I wouldn't've if he didn't swap out for it, though.</p><p></p><p>However, as I've mentioned, it's not, "can I have blue eyes? Can I have short brown hair? Can I say, "die, orc!"? Can I attack the orc?" It's almost exclusively "I do X", or the player saying "YZ" in-character. And, it's probably assumed true unless there's a reason to doubt it. But that doesn't mean it is by default. As always, play what you like <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile :)" data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /></p><p></p><p></p><p>I think people are too focused on these statements (or at least Monte's). I think Monte was throwing out a summary, and is getting gaming philosophy back at him. I can't say for Vincent. </p><p></p><p></p><p>Yep, no disagreements with this line of thought.</p><p></p><p></p><p>I've not played CoC, but I assume this would be fine in-game? No idea, really.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Considering I follow the rules they do when it comes to modeling the game world, yes. I mean, I have other things I do that are highly divorced from the rules, but so do the players. I don't use an exception-based design for my game. I don't build monsters or NPCs different than PCs do (though I do get to sum mine up within seconds or minutes, where they don't get to).</p><p></p><p>When it comes to actual rules of interacting within the game, the PCs and NPCs are even. Yes, I can say, "this guy is hit die 16!" and the PCs can't. However, there's no rules hardwired into the game telling me not to do that, or that I can't, or that I shouldn't.</p><p></p><p>If you're trying to say that some rules model the game world, and other rules help give a common ground to everyone at the table, then I agree, as that's what I said. If you're saying that it also involves something else, what did you have in mind? I'm open to more options. I'm just summing up here, anyways. As always, play what you like <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile :)" data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /></p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="JamesonCourage, post: 5716107, member: 6668292"] In a way. The player won't ask permission, but just because he says it, it doesn't mean his character gets to say it. That is, if a PC says "I say XYZ" and there's nothing stopping him, then he says it. However, if I know that something will stop him, whether it's him noticing something, someone ready to stop him by attacking or cutting him off, etc., then the PC does not get to say that unhindered (or possibly at all). It's not based on "I say XYZ. Okay?" That's not what I said. I just said that I determine if that's true or not. They can (and do) say, "XYZ" (they don't say "I say" first the huge majority of the time), and most of the time there's no problem. At no point is there a "I attempt to say XYZ" unless the circumstances overtly call for it. Yes, but it's the same scenario. Most of the time, it's "I swing my sword at the orc" and then it's an attack roll. However, just because a player says as much, it doesn't mean it happens. And, I suspect this is true of 4e, too. Any interrupt action can stop the attack, or a readied action, or sometimes spotting something. For example, it might be: Player: "I turn and attack the orc on my right." GM: "Roll Spot." Player: "Okay... 22." GM: "When you turn your attention to this specific orc, you notice the hidden marking of the allied thief guild on the orc's forearm." Player: "Hmm, but he's attacking. Then again, we know that someone in this very group we're fighting can cast [I]Dominate[/I]. Either he's enchanted, or he's a traitor, but either way I want him alive. I'll deal nonlethal damage." GM: "You take a..." Player: "Penalty to my attacks, yeah, I know. I'll attack anyways." GM: "Go ahead and roll." I doubt this situation is far off from 4e (not necessarily your group, but 4e). Thus, unless I say it's true, it doesn't happen. Yep, this is generally true. However, if a player is acting in a very lighthearted way, and I say, "you're in a bad mood," he will almost certainly ask why. I might tell him a reason, or I might say, "you just are". Either way, I know why (and it's almost certainly magical in nature). PC mood is very intimate to a player, so I try not to override things like that. Additionally, I've known all but one of the players for 13+ years, so I have a good grasp on what sets their PCs off most of the time, so I can say, "you're in a bad mood" with some certainty that they'll agree. If the player asks, "why?" and I say, "because you got food poisoning from that chef you've been trying to get rid of that's in a relationship with your love interest" I assume it's good enough for some players (but not for others). If, however, he says, "I'm probably a little annoyed, but my mood is fine," I might be surprised, but I'll let it go; that player knows the PC better than I do. As far as hair styles and such go, I try to communicate generally different clothes styles, hair styles, etc. of each region, nation, or social status on the map (that is, if players are interested, or if it's dramatically abnormal or otherwise important). In my current game, you can have different amounts of status mechanically with your PC, and only the nobility are assumed to be tall, strong, attractive looking by default, due to the dietary habits, breeding, and the like. So, when one PC who was low Status said he was 5'11", I said, "that's probably too tall for your status. The average is closer to 5'4", but you theoretically be that tall. It'd just be pretty rare." He changed his height to 5'3" and we moved on (this is the player I've known for about two months now). At any rate, yes, things get cleared before they happen in-game. That same player has two eyes of a different color once before, and when I noticed it was on his sheet, I told him to change it (there's a way to note such abnormalities mechanically, and he didn't take it). He asked if he could swap to get that mechanical "benefit", and I let him. I wouldn't've if he didn't swap out for it, though. However, as I've mentioned, it's not, "can I have blue eyes? Can I have short brown hair? Can I say, "die, orc!"? Can I attack the orc?" It's almost exclusively "I do X", or the player saying "YZ" in-character. And, it's probably assumed true unless there's a reason to doubt it. But that doesn't mean it is by default. As always, play what you like :) I think people are too focused on these statements (or at least Monte's). I think Monte was throwing out a summary, and is getting gaming philosophy back at him. I can't say for Vincent. Yep, no disagreements with this line of thought. I've not played CoC, but I assume this would be fine in-game? No idea, really. Considering I follow the rules they do when it comes to modeling the game world, yes. I mean, I have other things I do that are highly divorced from the rules, but so do the players. I don't use an exception-based design for my game. I don't build monsters or NPCs different than PCs do (though I do get to sum mine up within seconds or minutes, where they don't get to). When it comes to actual rules of interacting within the game, the PCs and NPCs are even. Yes, I can say, "this guy is hit die 16!" and the PCs can't. However, there's no rules hardwired into the game telling me not to do that, or that I can't, or that I shouldn't. If you're trying to say that some rules model the game world, and other rules help give a common ground to everyone at the table, then I agree, as that's what I said. If you're saying that it also involves something else, what did you have in mind? I'm open to more options. I'm just summing up here, anyways. As always, play what you like :) [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
Monte Cook on what rules are for
Top