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Message: <blockquote data-quote="bret" data-source="post: 808030" data-attributes="member: 713">Rogue Unique skills: There aren't that many skills that a Rogue gets which a Bard doesn't.Bard gets Alchemy, Speak Language, Scry, Concentrate, the Knowledge Skills, and Spellcraft.Rogue gets Disable Device, Forgery, Innuendo, Intimidate, Open Lock, Search, Read Lips, and Spot.The traps ability really isn't that much fun. Traps are the rogue's version of healing spells. I get to have the GM roll a dice to decide if I'm going to die. Either the player has put enough points into the two skills (Search and Disable Device) to do the job, in which case they have the same number of remaining skill points as the Bard and Ranger, or they didn't put enough points in and die.In many groups, the Rogue is expected to invest in both search and disable device just like the cleric is expected to heal. In some groups, it can be a little more fun if the GM allows the Rogue to set traps.Read Lips is the only skill that is truely exclusive to the rogue.There are so many ways to prevent Sneak Attacks, it isn't even funny. At high levels, a fair number of fighters are going to want armor with Fortification on it just to prevent the wild critical hits. It has the added bonus of stopping Sneak Attacks. Any concealment stop it. Many summoned creatures can not be sneak attacked.The sneak attack is nice, but that is about the only thing the rogue has that is effective in combat. Compare it to the BAB of a ranger or the spells that a Bard can pump out, it starts looking a bit weak.Evasion and Uncanny Dodge are available in any number of PrCs. Speaking of which, almost every rogue PrC only gives 6 skill points or less.I've seen a lot more people take rogue for the skill points than other reasons. I can't help thinking that bumping the Ranger and Bard is going to take away from the rogue.Guess we will find out about a year after the new edition is out what effect it really had.BTW: The Rogues skills have steadily decreased with each edition. They allow you to choose how to specialize, but the total skill ability has steadily decreased.</blockquote>

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