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<blockquote data-quote="Acmite" data-source="post: 808701" data-attributes="member: 183">Power gamers in a game where character background and role-playing matter little, maybe.&nbsp; How does that character justify taking a level in Ranger?&nbsp; Who taught him those virtual feats?&nbsp; Why did he/she suudenly switch career paths only to return to their former profession immediately afterwards?It seems to me you have a problem with a certain type of gamer, a certain type of DM, and a certain type of campaign and not necessarily with the rules themselves.&nbsp; If DMs let players make inconceivable or illogical advancement choices (like a 10th level paladin in a military campaign suddenly take a level of Wizards despite not having even seen an arcane caster in years, or urban rogues who have never left the city take a level in Ranger) then that seems to be a problem with the campaign and/or DM, not the rules.'Sides, the new Ranger seems to lessen the effectiveness of that cheesy multi-class--now you only get one feat (TWF instead of TWF and Ambi-dex, albeit there is no Ambi-dex anymore) and at 2nd level to boot.I agree about the shoe-horning for actual Ranger players, though.&nbsp; Personally, I'm still waiting for TWF with Hand-axes or daggers to become a viable combat option.&nbsp; I think more official combat style options would go a long way to making people happy with the new ranger.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Acmite, post: 808701, member: 183"] Power gamers in a game where character background and role-playing matter little, maybe. How does that character justify taking a level in Ranger? Who taught him those virtual feats? Why did he/she suudenly switch career paths only to return to their former profession immediately afterwards? It seems to me you have a problem with a certain type of gamer, a certain type of DM, and a certain type of campaign and not necessarily with the rules themselves. If DMs let players make inconceivable or illogical advancement choices (like a 10th level paladin in a military campaign suddenly take a level of Wizards despite not having even seen an arcane caster in years, or urban rogues who have never left the city take a level in Ranger) then that seems to be a problem with the campaign and/or DM, not the rules. 'Sides, the new Ranger seems to lessen the effectiveness of that cheesy multi-class--now you only get one feat (TWF instead of TWF and Ambi-dex, albeit there is no Ambi-dex anymore) and at 2nd level to boot. I agree about the shoe-horning for actual Ranger players, though. Personally, I'm still waiting for TWF with Hand-axes or daggers to become a viable combat option. I think more official combat style options would go a long way to making people happy with the new ranger. [/QUOTE]

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