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Message: <blockquote data-quote="XCorvis" data-source="post: 2842441" data-attributes="member: 1265">I'd have to disagree there. He goes into great detail about the problems that the regular diplomacy check has, and the main change is fundamental. Burlew's diplomacy is not the same as the normal diplomacy - his version is "getting someone to do something", not "changing how someone feels about you." And when you take advantage of it, it's just as bad as regular diplomacy, not worse. Anyway, with your +50 Diplomacy check, you can abuse the current system just as badly. You could change a Hostile character to Helpful automatically, in one minute. (You can rush it and just take them to friendly, if you want.) Kiss your BBEG goodbye.Rules here: <a href="http://www.giantitp.com/Func0010.html" target="_blank">http://www.giantitp.com/Func0010.html</a>With Burlew's system, assume an equally hostile character: an enemy (+5) of equal level (+15), Wisdom of 14 (+2) and the deal offered is horrible (+10). That's a DC of 47 (15+5+15+10+2). If you make the enemy truly hostile (nemesis, +10) and have a Wisdom of 20 (+5), the DC goes to 55. Sure, with a sucessful check you might get him to stop fighting, or give up the MacGuffin, but he still hates you, and you'll still have to make checks to get him to do anything else. Ultimately, they suffer from the same issue: a specially built character breaks diplomacy. Speaking of specially built, what's the max AC at now? 147 or something like that, right?You are right about one thing. Beans for artifacts? Not on your life. As with any rule, obviously idiotic things just shouldn't be allowed. That line is a lot fuzzier with regular diplomacy. Under what circumstances is it OK to change how someone feels about your character? Is Hostile to Friendly OK, but Hostile to Helpful not? Hard to say. How does the BBEG feel about you when you suddenly convince him to be friendly or helpful to you? Tough call.In the end, I like Burlew's system because of the conceptual change, not the actual mechanics (although having it scale with level is also very appealing). I think most DMs would have an easier time adjucating Burlew's system than the regular one.</blockquote>

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