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<blockquote data-quote="toucanbuzz" data-source="post: 8201266" data-attributes="member: 19270">Yep, and I knew what you meant by saying punting, which may throw folks off by insinuating failure. They succeeded by giving the rule back to the DM to adjudicate with &quot;common sense&quot; as an inflexible mechanic could lead to absurdity.The <a href="https://theangrygm.com/why-rules-exist/" target="_blank">AngryGM has an overly wordy but wise insight</a> into D&amp;D Rules, including what he calls the Rules of Resolution and Rules of Structure. Resolution allows us to simulate reality, as realistically as we can (e.g. DC checks for climbing), while Structure gives us often unreal rules necessary for the game to run (e.g. everyone takes 1 turn in combat, in order, before the next guy goes).Plugging Stealth into this, if it becomes a Rule of Structure (that Stealth is only detected with a successful Perception check), it could get absurd. &quot;Of course I see the guy coming out of the shadows from 20' away. I'm not blind, and I'm not stupid, and I heard him fart back there.&quot; The same thing applies to use of Charisma-skills and so on. &quot;It doesn't matter if you rolled a Natural 20. You spit in the king's face and insulted his daughter's character. He's tossing you in the dungeon.&quot; </blockquote>

[QUOTE="toucanbuzz, post: 8201266, member: 19270"] Yep, and I knew what you meant by saying punting, which may throw folks off by insinuating failure. They succeeded by giving the rule back to the DM to adjudicate with "common sense" as an inflexible mechanic could lead to absurdity. The [URL='https://theangrygm.com/why-rules-exist/']AngryGM has an overly wordy but wise insight[/URL] into D&D Rules, including what he calls the Rules of Resolution and Rules of Structure. Resolution allows us to simulate reality, as realistically as we can (e.g. DC checks for climbing), while Structure gives us often unreal rules necessary for the game to run (e.g. everyone takes 1 turn in combat, in order, before the next guy goes). Plugging Stealth into this, if it becomes a Rule of Structure (that Stealth is only detected with a successful Perception check), it could get absurd. [I]"Of course I see the guy coming out of the shadows from 20' away. I'm not blind, and I'm not stupid, and I heard him fart back there." [/I]The same thing applies to use of Charisma-skills and so on. [I]"It doesn't matter if you rolled a Natural 20. You spit in the king's face and insulted his daughter's character. He's tossing you in the dungeon." [/I] [/QUOTE]

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