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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Crazy Jerome" data-source="post: 5756406" data-attributes="member: 54877">I think there are three main factors to consider here:<ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">System should be fast--else, why bother? So handling time is a premium, and conditions/ongoing damage are a big offender.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Yet, you want something that roughly corresponds to the power balance now.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Going before the monsters should matter, but not grossly.</li> </ul>I think that once you go to side versus side initiative, rolling every round actually splits the middle on those pretty well, with less side effects. You do end up with something a bit different, however. With the order as masshysteria stated, saves happening before conditions/ongoing works perfectly, if you do apply the conditions/ongoing immediately, but do not start the "end of next turn" or similar counts until step 7, and don't apply old ones until then. Handling time: When a character or monster does something, boom, it happens. Immediately, any condition or ongoing damage applied becomes an "old condition" to be referred to later. Power balance: Conditions, when first applied, are a little more swingy in effect when interacting with the variable turn order. This should even out over a battle, because of rolling every time. If you don't roll every time, it becomes a predictable thing that players will work to maximize. Plus, going first means that after you go there is chance that the monsters will go twice before you go again (i.e. you fail next round).  OTOH, being stuck last means you are sure that the monsters will go at most once before you act again, and possibly not at all.  This uncertainity is critical, I think to making such a system work. Going first matters: If you go before the monsters, you are sure that any condition you manage to inflict will affect the monsters this round, before they can save. If you go after, it may affect them briefly, but not substantially. OTOH, a condition applied after the monster goes, that the monster does not save against, is one that is going to affect the monster the whole next round, and before anyone on his side is going to be able to help with. Basically, better to go first, but not so much better that you wouldn't take a shot sometimes when going last. A similar logic applies in reverse to the PCs getting hit with such stuff. Go first, then get hit, you've got no chance to use a power to bail out--but someone going last can bail you out. Go last, get hit, you can react, but someone else going last can't bail you out.  I also like it for tracking conditions. Since all conditions/ongoing are "old" at the end of the round, you just check them all.</blockquote>

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