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<blockquote data-quote="Dannyalcatraz" data-source="post: 5799508" data-attributes="member: 19675">They are- for D&amp;D.&nbsp; How mechanics in other RPG systems- however closely related they may be to D&amp;D- is irrelevant to the irreducibility of a class within D&amp;D.if you think you've scored some kind of point here, you don't know me. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile&nbsp; &nbsp; :)"&nbsp; data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />I didn't say it was bad, I said it was inefficient and slow.&nbsp; That is not a value judgement, it is a plain vanilla mechanical assessment.&nbsp; If that is how you want to build your PC, more power to you.I have a PC (in a 3.5Ed campaign on hiatus) who is a PHB Sorcerer who wears Scale Mail and uses Maul, and has done so since level 1- efficiency is not my motto in PC design.Nope- he got some intensive training at one point in his life, and mastered the basics.&nbsp; His BAB still won't increase like a dedicated warrior, though.The basics of many things can be learned and retained for a lifetime.&nbsp; I know enough of a few languages to keep myself fed, sheltered, and ask for help- but mastery takes a while.&nbsp; (There are only 2 languages I know well enough to read a novel.)Even though I only played organized football for 1 season in HS, decades later, I still know how to properly don the pads- which vary by position- do a form tackle, and a few other tricks.&nbsp; But even if I were currently in shape, my skills would pale in comparison to someone who played 4 years in HS or anything more than that.As I've said elsewhere, my favorite system of all time is HERO, and I can build any D&amp;D PC from any version in it.&nbsp; Much the same could probably be said of GURPS or M&amp;M's W&amp;W sourcebook....because they are classless systems.Like the game though I do, IMHO, True20's classes are virtually devoid of flavor, to the point that the game might as well have gone the way of W&amp;W.&nbsp; True20's classes are nothing to write home about.You want 100% character cconcept modeling, don't look for it in a system with classes.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Dannyalcatraz, post: 5799508, member: 19675"] They are- for D&D. How mechanics in other RPG systems- however closely related they may be to D&D- is irrelevant to the irreducibility of a class within D&D. if you think you've scored some kind of point here, you don't know me. :) I didn't say it was bad, I said it was inefficient and slow. That is not a value judgement, it is a plain vanilla mechanical assessment. If that is how you want to build your PC, more power to you. I have a PC (in a 3.5Ed campaign on hiatus) who is a PHB Sorcerer who wears Scale Mail and uses Maul, and has done so since level 1- efficiency is not my motto in PC design. Nope- he got some intensive training at one point in his life, and mastered the basics. His BAB still won't increase like a dedicated warrior, though. The basics of many things can be learned and retained for a lifetime. I know enough of a few languages to keep myself fed, sheltered, and ask for help- but mastery takes a while. (There are only 2 languages I know well enough to read a novel.) Even though I only played organized football for 1 season in HS, decades later, I still know how to properly don the pads- which vary by position- do a form tackle, and a few other tricks. But even if I were currently in shape, my skills would pale in comparison to someone who played 4 years in HS or anything more than that. As I've said elsewhere, my favorite system of all time is HERO, and I can build any D&D PC from any version in it. Much the same could probably be said of GURPS or M&M's W&W sourcebook. ...because they are classless systems. Like the game though I do, IMHO, True20's classes are virtually devoid of flavor, to the point that the game might as well have gone the way of W&W. True20's classes are nothing to write home about. You want 100% character cconcept modeling, don't look for it in a system with classes. [/QUOTE]

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