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Message: <blockquote data-quote="FrogReaver" data-source="post: 7015066" data-attributes="member: 6795602">I will get back to this question in a separate post.It's rather hard to make a point without some kind of quantifier for something that is next to impossible for us to measure.  So we use the best quantifiers we have to describe our viewpoint, mostly, nearly always, always etc. The issue always comes up where one person says always and another pinpoints a single example that technically refutes the always quantifier.  That kind of behavior rarely adds much productive to the discussion (unless we are dealing with a topic we can speak of with far more precision than we can most forum topics).  I mean so what if I was wrong about always and it's really 99/100 times or 97/100 times.  Really what bearing does that make?  Why is it even worth pointing out.  Just say in passing, I'm sure you just meant most of the time and I happen to disagree about that and think xyz doesn't happen very often because abcIf it's an EB build it will be fine.  So I wouldn't outright ban.  I would just make sure that the player doing it knew that his multiclassing would likely leave him very weak at level 5-6.  I usually play or run in smaller person games as well and the difference between a caster having fireball on time or a melee character getting extra attack on time is much more apparent in these circumstances with fewer players.  Such issues in 6 player games and slightly smaller can probably be overlooked as long as it's just 1-2 players doing it.  Keep in mind I think most characters multiclass perfectly fine post level 5.  Fighter 5 / Sorceror 6 makes a great character for example.  So I'm not against multiclassing in general.  I just think it's a poor path for pre level 5 characters.  So I may start out arcane trickster till level 5 and then alternate wizard and rogue levels to it or whatever progression gets me the feel I want.  That said if I wanted a melee character with innate magical powers there's a tons of different ways you could design him from level 1+.  Spell slots may not even be the best mechanic to show the characters powers.  However, if you did want spell slots there could be a separate class designed for that too.  The issue is that if well designed then such a character will play well and give you that flavor and theme from level 1+.  Another example, a fighter giving up some of his lower level features in order to get a spell slot at level 1 or a cantrip at level 1 and a single spell slot at level 2 can also help scratch the itch.  We could create this "class" and call it variant fighter or something like that.  There's a lot of ideas and probably the best way to illustrate it would be to start with a character concept and show how much better I can approximate the concept and earlier without having to give up the standard 5e power curve.  If we are discussing something and we are making points and counter points then we are "arguing" and having an "argument" no matter what the connotation of the word says.  So please don't take me saying that we are having an "argument" means we are yelling at each other in angry tones and calling each other names.All I have to say is that numbers don't lie.  I can give you a very good ballpark of how far down your combat abilities will be.  I can then try to explain that the faster the enemies die the less damage you take and the less likely you are to die.  What exactly does "horizontal depth" get you?  (I mean in the right party situation there may be some reason to level dip to get spells like pass without trace or healing word or spells that help with fear, etc).  You may even want to do this pre level 5 is your party is covered on enough extra attackers and AOE casters such that adding one more of either wouldn't make as large of a difference as the party utility abilities you will be bringing.  But in general in a party of 4-6 most abilities can be covered by someone and so there is even less incentive to get off track IMO.  In a smaller party you can't afford not to stay on track because you may be 33% to 50% of your parties combat ability.  You taking the less vertical path means you will offer about half as much each combat.  That's a big percent decrease in party capability for the little bit of horizontal depth you are adding IMO.</blockquote>

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