Reply to thread

Message

<blockquote data-quote="Ovarwa" data-source="post: 7020233" data-attributes="member: 75153">Hi,&nbsp;&nbsp; *lol* Of course you'd say that; they essentially recapitulate your point!&nbsp; (Though with a slightly different emphasis:&nbsp; I'm saying that it is proper for most combos to suck, and that doesn't necessarily make multiclassing suck.)&nbsp; BTW, don't you agree with my last paragraph too?&nbsp; <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile&nbsp; &nbsp; :)"&nbsp; data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />/10&nbsp; Adding to that, I think that anyone considering a multiclass should think about whether character optimization is better than group optimization:&nbsp; A group that works together is usually best off with *specialists*, and specialization usually involves concentrating on a single class.&nbsp; In a DPR comparison, a lone character might showcase his ability to Haste himself and wade into combat.&nbsp; But a character in a group who lets a straight spellcaster Haste him gets to do this at level 5.&nbsp;&nbsp; It isn't just crossbow, though.&nbsp; F1/B1 can also do greatsword.&nbsp; Or cower behind a shield while casting cantrips and concentrating on Bless.&nbsp; +4AC is a pretty big deal.&nbsp; In some games, the ones in which F1/BX is most tempting, the advantage isn't slight.</blockquote>----------------------------------- Fighter 1 Bard 2 2nd Wind at 1d10+1 per short rest +1 ac fighting style 17 ac crossbow +2 hp con proficiency&nbsp; Bard 3 +2 level 2 spell slots +1 level 1 spell slot +1 spell known expertise +3 skill proficiencies cutting words&nbsp; I'd give the bard 3 moderate advantage here. [/quote] I don't know that I would.&nbsp; Of course, we'll see this pattern repeat every odd level through 17, as BardX gets a new spell level!&nbsp; F1/BX pays a price for his robustness, as he should.&nbsp; But that +4ac and ability to fare decently in melee still shine.&nbsp; He isn't as good a Bard as BardX, but might last quite a bit longer.&nbsp; Level 5 is always nice. Except for a Moon Druid. [/quote] So through those 5 levels I'd say the solo class bard is better.&nbsp; It's a somewhat subjective comparison and so you may come away with different results than me but I did try to be fair about it. [/quote] Even by your lights, Bard wins 2, F/B wins 2, and level 1 is a tie.&nbsp; That's hardly suckful!&nbsp; I too prefer a straight Bard, but cannot underestimate the attraction of wanting to survive a few hits, and maintain concentration.&nbsp; Other combinations tilt&nbsp; a bit more in favor of a multiclass.&nbsp; F1/BladeX?&nbsp; F1/AbjX?&nbsp; Cl1/WizX?&nbsp; PalY/TomeX?&nbsp; But if most combos fail, that's good.&nbsp; If single class is viable, also good.&nbsp; If people post about multi-classing being overpowered, maybe not so good.&nbsp; Anyway,&nbsp; Ken[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE="Ovarwa, post: 7020233, member: 75153"] Hi, *lol* Of course you'd say that; they essentially recapitulate your point! (Though with a slightly different emphasis: I'm saying that it is proper for most combos to suck, and that doesn't necessarily make multiclassing suck.) BTW, don't you agree with my last paragraph too? :)/10 Adding to that, I think that anyone considering a multiclass should think about whether character optimization is better than group optimization: A group that works together is usually best off with *specialists*, and specialization usually involves concentrating on a single class. In a DPR comparison, a lone character might showcase his ability to Haste himself and wade into combat. But a character in a group who lets a straight spellcaster Haste him gets to do this at level 5. It isn't just crossbow, though. F1/B1 can also do greatsword. Or cower behind a shield while casting cantrips and concentrating on Bless. +4AC is a pretty big deal. In some games, the ones in which F1/BX is most tempting, the advantage isn't slight. [/quote] ----------------------------------- Fighter 1 Bard 2 2nd Wind at 1d10+1 per short rest +1 ac fighting style 17 ac crossbow +2 hp con proficiency Bard 3 +2 level 2 spell slots +1 level 1 spell slot +1 spell known expertise +3 skill proficiencies cutting words I'd give the bard 3 moderate advantage here. [/quote] I don't know that I would. Of course, we'll see this pattern repeat every odd level through 17, as BardX gets a new spell level! F1/BX pays a price for his robustness, as he should. But that +4ac and ability to fare decently in melee still shine. He isn't as good a Bard as BardX, but might last quite a bit longer. Level 5 is always nice. Except for a Moon Druid. [/quote] So through those 5 levels I'd say the solo class bard is better. It's a somewhat subjective comparison and so you may come away with different results than me but I did try to be fair about it. [/quote] Even by your lights, Bard wins 2, F/B wins 2, and level 1 is a tie. That's hardly suckful! I too prefer a straight Bard, but cannot underestimate the attraction of wanting to survive a few hits, and maintain concentration. Other combinations tilt a bit more in favor of a multiclass. F1/BladeX? F1/AbjX? Cl1/WizX? PalY/TomeX? But if most combos fail, that's good. If single class is viable, also good. If people post about multi-classing being overpowered, maybe not so good. Anyway, Ken [/QUOTE]

Verification