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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Falling Icicle" data-source="post: 6273910" data-attributes="member: 17077">I'm coming into this discussion a bit late, but I just wanted to share a few of my thoughts.As far as proficiencies go, I honestly don't see a problem with getting all of the weapon and armor proficiencies of a class when you multiclass into it. Nobody is complaining that a single class fighter starts the game with every weapon and armor proficiency. So if it's okay for a single class character to get all of that with one level, why is it a problem for a multiclass character to get the same? Some people have suggested that people should only get one or two profs. from secondary classes. I think that's a terrible idea. Why should a fighter/wizard have more proficiencies than a wizard/fighter? By doing things like that, we're making the order in which you multiclass mechanically important, and I think that's a bad thing. It just leads to trap options and having to plan your character build in advance lest you make an inferior character.I don't think proficiencies are as big of a deal as people make them out to be. Martial weapons only do 1-2 more points of damage on average than simple weapons do. Plus, the proficiencies of many classes overlap. Wizards becoming fighters is really the most extreme example of the proficiencies that can be gained through multi-classing, and even then, I don't think it's as big of a deal as people are making it out to be. Wizards usually don't care much about weapon proficiencies anyway. Those that do are probably trying to build a "gish" type character, and that's really not a power play at all. If anything, I've found such characters to usually be weaker than single class wizards or fighters.As for armor, again, I think people are overreacting. Heavy armor is really not that much better than light armor. It really isn't. It comes with all kinds of drawbacks that light armor doesn't have, plus, it doesn't let you use your Dex modifier. Sure, that means you don't need to invest anything in Dex to have a decent AC, but Dex has all kinds of other important uses that make it a valuable thing to sacrifice anyway. Heavy armor also tends to be quite expensive, and being a wizard has never been an inexpensive profession. Wizards can already get a really good AC anyway, and with defensive buffs like invisibility, mirror image, fly, stoneskin, etc., they don't depend as much on AC as other characters do. Putting yourself a level behind other wizards in getting new spells is a pretty big sacrifice to make. Taking a 1 level fighter dip to get heavy armor prof. is a respectable option, but it's far from overpowered IMO.On the subject of ability requirements for multi-classing, I don't really like them. I feel like they're a poor way to balance multi-classing. They don't matter at all for some characters, but on the other hand can be a barrier to entry for legitimate and non-power-playing character concepts. I also don't think they really make any sense. If a multiclass wizards needs a 15 Int, why is it okay to play a single-class wizard with an 8 Int? If anything, the single class wizard should need Int more than the multiclass one. Not that I'm arguing for classes to have minimum ability requirements. I prefer the carrot to the stick. Right now, the only benefit to a higher magic ability modifier is save DCs and spell attack rolls. The problem is there are a lot of spells that don't have either of those things, so one's magic ability score doesn't make any difference for them. I think there needs to be more benefits to having a higher ability mod, such as bonus spells per day. I don't think the bonus spells per day table from 3.x would break the game, especially considering that ability scores are now capped at 20. At the very most, characters could get two bonus 1st level spells, and one bonus spell of 2nd through 5th.</blockquote>

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