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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Andor" data-source="post: 2636070" data-attributes="member: 1879">The trouble is that this all sounds great, but the mechanics of the system don't support it. If the monk is staying mobile that means either he is sucking AOOs like nobodys business, or he has spent three feats to gain the ability to fight without using his flurry of blows. And it has been pointed out a monk trading blow for blow with a fighter is a dead monk.He can't take away his opponents weapon, unless he has spent even more feats to avoid those deadly AOOs, and then his hands are light weapons, so he'll be at -4 to -8 taking the weapon away from a characer who almost certainly has higher strength in the first place.And sneaking around so he can attack by surprise gains him no mechanical benefit since he A) has no sneak attack and B) Can't power attack since his hands are light weapons. Since this isn't the 'monks suck' thread lets bring this back into perspective. A monk can stay alive by running away but this in point of fact does nothing to benefit his party. Since he has no spells or support abilities the only thing the monk can do is fight. Due to his mediocre BAB and light fists he needs better strength than a fighter to able to fight as well. Due to his d8 hp he needs better con than the fighter to have the same staying power. Due to his inability to wear armour he needs better dex than the rogue to match his AC (and the rogue has more utility both in and out of combat than a monk does.) If he wants to use pretty much any of his class abilities he also needs a decent wis.You can claim the monk doesn't have MAD all you want, but it's patent foolishness. The question is not 'Can I play a monk with poor stats?' Obviously you can. You can play an awakened Chihuahua with levels in commoner if you want to. The question is 'Is the monk an effective charactar with poor stats?' And the answer to that is no. The trouble is that out of the box the monk is only good at one thing, and that is being the mage killer. And that is too narrow a role to be truly useful. And in order to branch out from that role, the mechanical system of the game demands good stats in order to be effective. 16,10,10,10,10,10 is a viable stat array for any of the base 4 classes. A monk with those stats should spend his spare time carving his tombstone.</blockquote>

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