Multiple Saves or One?

[kreynolds]

The reason I say only 1 save in overlapping areas is because of the Darkness/Daylight argument. For instance, if you have two areas of Darkness that overlap each other and you bring in an object that has the Daylight spell cast upon it, the Daylight spell will negate both of the Darkness spells in the area of overlap, leaving normal lighting conditions. The two darkness spells don't stack. They overlap, meaning they are treated as a single effect.

So, if you had two or three creatures that constantly radiate Darkness, then you need only bring in one Daylight spell to negate them all.

I can understand the idea that perhaps the DC for the save should be raised when you go with one save, but IMO, you are only saving against one effect when you are within an area of overlap. Why? First of all, as I said, they don't stack. Secondly, you wouldn't need to make any more saving throws unless you leave the area of effect and re-enter, or the area of effect is moved away from you and then back to you.

Logically, the number of saving throws can be argued either way, but IMO, I think the rules regarding overlapping effects takes priority here.

 

[hammymchamham]

1 save because it would be less dice rolling

 

[Caliban]

The reason I say only 1 save in overlapping areas is because of the Darkness/Daylight argument. For instance, if you have two areas of Darkness that overlap each other and you bring in an object that has the Daylight spell cast upon it, the Daylight spell will negate both of the Darkness spells in the area of overlap, leaving normal lighting conditions. The two darkness spells don't stack. They overlap, meaning they are treated as a single effect.

Overlap doesn't mean they are one effect though, it means that only the strongest one applies.

The endure elements, resist elements, and protection from elements spell overlap, but if you dispel one, the others are still left and would take effect normally.

Why would it be any different with light/darkness spells?

It might be that a single light spell would cancel out any single darkness of spell of equal level or lower, but the remaining one would still be in effect.

Now, it may very well be that multiple darkness spells could be countered by a single light spell of equal level due to the specific wording of those spells (because it says that they temporarily negate each other without placing a limit), but even if that is the case, I don't think that specific ruling would hold true to other overlapping effects.

In the case of the ghast stink, I think the "by the book" ruling would be that you make multiple saves, but the penalties are not cumulative if you fail. Only the strongest one would be in effect.

However, I think it would be a very reasonable house rule to say that the ghasts just combine into one very intense stench.

 

[kreynolds]

However, I think it would be a very reasonable house rule to say that the ghasts just combine into one very intense stench.

I do too, actually (though I'm not sure about the increased DC ). Besides, it would decrease the number of rolls you need to make, thus speed up the game, thus keep the tension alive. It's difficult as hell to keep the intense feeling of peril going when you have to stop and tell your four (or more) players to make three saves a piece.

But, I honestly don't think that the Daylight/Darkness situation is unique. In my opinion, it represents the standard scenario where multiple similar spells don't overlap. So, I guess you and I will just have to agree to disagree on this.