Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.
Rocket your D&D 5E and Level Up: Advanced 5E games into space! Alpha Star Magazine Is Launching... Right Now!
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
Muscular Neutrality (thought experiment)
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Steampunkette" data-source="post: 9533611" data-attributes="member: 6796468"><p>Foolishness, selfishness, or ignorance. </p><p></p><p>You could delude yourself into sitting on a fence, convinced that being "In the Middle" is superior, but it's ultimately a foolish position. You allow evil to exist, or even assist evil, because you think good is "Just as Bad" as evil and vice-versa. </p><p></p><p>It's the horseshoe theory of morality where good and evil are fundamentally the same thing and the only solution is to stick your fingers in your ears to the screams of the innocent harmed along the way because at least you're not the one harming them.</p><p></p><p>This is, by it's nature, a fundamental misunderstanding of the conflict between good and evil in every story and also in reality.</p><p></p><p>Good is a Reactive force. Evil is an Active force.</p><p></p><p>In the status quo, good seeks to improve things for those most harmed in a society to try and bring up the worst-off. And they do this largely through altruism: Giving of themselves to help others. Sure that can mean fighting dragons and defeating liches, but it's also charity or working in a soup kitchen or building an orphans and lost puppies hospital and orphanage.</p><p></p><p>Good responds to the ills that exist and selflessly gives of it's own attention, emotion, energy, and resources to fix the problems that exist.</p><p></p><p>Evil, on the other hand, actively seeks to do harm. Evil bans books and makes discriminatory laws, evil attacks innocents and steals money or food or the candy from babies (not that babies should -have- candy, but you know what I mean). Evil is not a passive force, it is an active force that seeks to gain for itself regardless of whom it harms along the way.</p><p></p><p>Good doesn't "Make Gains" against evil. Good fights when evil rears it's head, and the rest of the time it just chills out and helps people live their lives.</p><p></p><p>Meet me in the middle, says the unjust man.</p><p></p><p>Neutrals, even "Muscular" neutrals, favor the status quo. They'd rather keep the peace than seek justice. Even if that means allowing harm to continue or even explicitly taking part in harming others.</p><p></p><p>At best neutrals are willing to push back when evil goes "Too Far", but are happy to let innocents suffer so long as it's not "Too Many" innocents. And there's no universe where that isn't a messed up way to be.</p><p></p><p>And a fundamental misunderstanding of active and reactive forces.</p><p></p><p>Yeah... There's very few versions of reality in which Neutrality is "Pragmatic". It's mostly just a bunch of fence-sitters allowing awful things to happen to "Someone Else". 'Cause as soon as the druid's grove is next on the chopping block -suddenly- evil has gone "Too Far" and must be fought against. Nevermind the villages and cities that have fallen to evil away from the grove...</p><p></p><p>I think that's, in the end, the core of neutrality. Being uninvolved until threatened, -then- choosing a side. And they only consider the "Balance" threatened when good is winning the fight.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Steampunkette, post: 9533611, member: 6796468"] Foolishness, selfishness, or ignorance. You could delude yourself into sitting on a fence, convinced that being "In the Middle" is superior, but it's ultimately a foolish position. You allow evil to exist, or even assist evil, because you think good is "Just as Bad" as evil and vice-versa. It's the horseshoe theory of morality where good and evil are fundamentally the same thing and the only solution is to stick your fingers in your ears to the screams of the innocent harmed along the way because at least you're not the one harming them. This is, by it's nature, a fundamental misunderstanding of the conflict between good and evil in every story and also in reality. Good is a Reactive force. Evil is an Active force. In the status quo, good seeks to improve things for those most harmed in a society to try and bring up the worst-off. And they do this largely through altruism: Giving of themselves to help others. Sure that can mean fighting dragons and defeating liches, but it's also charity or working in a soup kitchen or building an orphans and lost puppies hospital and orphanage. Good responds to the ills that exist and selflessly gives of it's own attention, emotion, energy, and resources to fix the problems that exist. Evil, on the other hand, actively seeks to do harm. Evil bans books and makes discriminatory laws, evil attacks innocents and steals money or food or the candy from babies (not that babies should -have- candy, but you know what I mean). Evil is not a passive force, it is an active force that seeks to gain for itself regardless of whom it harms along the way. Good doesn't "Make Gains" against evil. Good fights when evil rears it's head, and the rest of the time it just chills out and helps people live their lives. Meet me in the middle, says the unjust man. Neutrals, even "Muscular" neutrals, favor the status quo. They'd rather keep the peace than seek justice. Even if that means allowing harm to continue or even explicitly taking part in harming others. At best neutrals are willing to push back when evil goes "Too Far", but are happy to let innocents suffer so long as it's not "Too Many" innocents. And there's no universe where that isn't a messed up way to be. And a fundamental misunderstanding of active and reactive forces. Yeah... There's very few versions of reality in which Neutrality is "Pragmatic". It's mostly just a bunch of fence-sitters allowing awful things to happen to "Someone Else". 'Cause as soon as the druid's grove is next on the chopping block -suddenly- evil has gone "Too Far" and must be fought against. Nevermind the villages and cities that have fallen to evil away from the grove... I think that's, in the end, the core of neutrality. Being uninvolved until threatened, -then- choosing a side. And they only consider the "Balance" threatened when good is winning the fight. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
Muscular Neutrality (thought experiment)
Top