Mutants & Masterminds: Newbie hero creation question

[Greybar]

Okay, I'm confused by an application of the PL rules

The rulebook seems to clearly state that the sum of the SVs (Fort, Rfx, Will) cannot exceed PL+5. Yet the sample archetypes and even the example creation of the costumed adventurer seems to imply that the limit is on each individual SV. (the archetype is Fort +6, Rfx +10, Will +10). So I'm guessing that I'm wrong here.

Which also makes sense, because I'm in the middle of making a character and seem to be running into PL limits all over the place with almost 20 pp left to spend...

anyone have any nuggets of wisdom for the first-time MnM player? Things that you realized after your first campaign that we should look out for?

Thanks in Advance!

 

[Jim Hague]

Happy to help. Check pp. 25 of MnM 2e -

Max Attack/Defense (barring tradeoffs) - equal to PL
Max Save DC modifier (again, barring Damage/attack tradeoffs) - equals PL
Max toughness (barring defense/toughness tradeoffs) - equal to PL
Max save/ability bonus (per ability/save) - PL+5
Max ability score - see the modifier equivalents
Max skill rank - PL+5

Another thing that might trip you up - powers which have no save (Super-Senses, movement powers, etc.) are not limited by PL.

 

[ZombieButch]

Okay, I'm confused by an application of the PL rules

The rulebook seems to clearly state that the sum of the SVs (Fort, Rfx, Will) cannot exceed PL+5. Yet the sample archetypes and even the example creation of the costumed adventurer seems to imply that the limit is on each individual SV. (the archetype is Fort +6, Rfx +10, Will +10). So I'm guessing that I'm wrong here.

You are, and you're right, it probably should have been reworded. Where it says, "Your hero's total Fortitude, Reflex, and Will save modifiers", it means, "Your total Fortitude, your total Reflex, and your total Will save modifiers", not "The total of all three".

anyone have any nuggets of wisdom for the first-time MnM player? Things that you realized after your first campaign that we should look out for?

Thanks in Advance!

One that a lot of folks miss the first time out is that you can't buy extra Toughness save by itself; you can only increase it by buying up your CON or with powers. (Page 33, the paragraph right before Capabilities.)

Don't feel like you have to shell out a bunch of character points to buy up a bunch of Alternate Powers. Pick out one or two that you think you're likely to use, and use Extra Effort to power stunt the others in play. Eventually, you'll probably fine one or two that you use more often than others. Once you've got those figured out, you can spend an experience point to buy them permanently.

 

[Staffan]

One that a lot of folks miss the first time out is that you can't buy extra Toughness save by itself; you can only increase it by buying up your CON or with powers. (Page 33, the paragraph right before Capabilities.)

Or the Defensive Roll feat, though that doesn't work when you're flatfooted.

 

[Greybar]

Thanks for the note on Toughness, I had been buying it at 1pt per like the other Saves.

As for the Alternate Powers I was thinking about sketching out a couple to use with the extra-effort bit, so I'm glad to hear I'm on the right track.

 

[Pseudonym]

Another thing that might trip you up - powers which have no save (Super-Senses, movement powers, etc.) are not limited by PL.

I was about to post a thread on this, so I'll put this here. So I'm clear, ranks in powers that are not attacks have no PL limit? So a beginning PL10 character cn buy 20 ranks of Duplication or Flight?

How would PL limits apply to powers such as Telekinesis? Would a PL10 character be able to buy 15 ranks in Telekinesis? If you take the Damaging extra, then you inflict damage equal to rank, so that would then limit it to +10 or 10 ranks, but if you just use it to move things, then the number of ranks is unlimited? That seems off to me, especially since using your power rank as Strength to throw something heavy could lead to much more than a +10 damage.

Any clarity would be appreciated.

 

[Agamon]

Any use of a power that does not require a save can go over your PL. With Telekinesis w/Damaging extra, you can have the power be over your PL limit, but any damage done (or any other save required) is maxed out at the PL limit (barring trade-offs for attack/damage).

Eg: At PL10, you can have Telekinesis +15, but if you do damage with it, the damage save is limited to +10 (or a damage save of DC 25), unless you only have +5 to hit, in which case, you can use all +15 for damage, with trade-off.

 

[Pseudonym]

Any use of a power that does not require a save can go over your PL. With Telekinesis w/Damaging extra, you can have the power be over your PL limit, but any damage done (or any other save required) is maxed out at the PL limit (barring trade-offs for attack/damage).

Ah, thanks. That makes more sense.

 

[Ben Robbins]

Good to note that area attacks (which have no to hit rolls) are not affected by any attack trade-offs you take: they remain limited by straight PL.

It's easy to overlook that for feats like Super-Strength groundstrike etc. They are based on your strength score (which you might have raised over PL by lowering your attack bonus), but still capped by straight PL limits since they are area.


Also, even though the rules don't require it, many GMs will limit other powers to PL just so more powerful characters can do more powerful things (e.g. a PL 7 character can only run 1000 mph, but a PL 10 can run 10,000). Otherwise PL is just a combat rating, not really a power rating.