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Message: <blockquote data-quote="StreamOfTheSky" data-source="post: 4625633" data-attributes="member: 35909">I thought that was what you meant.  I still don't think it's necessary, nor particularly fair.  Combat is largely abstracted in D&D, and someone else already gave a good depiction of how you could use this against a giant in the middle of melee combat.  In general, if you're able to find a spot to crit the creature, why can't you also Shield Slam it?  This makes me think of the sneak attack text about being able to reach vitals.  I guess you could assume the giant's chest/head/etc... never comes within reach...but why even bother?I mostly just don't like the term "Barbarian," because I'm fairly new to D&D (only 8 years) and don't come with any prior edition sense of the word/class.  To me, the class always represented a type of warrior and fighting style -- hitting hard, entering a frenzied state, literally "toughing out" blows rather than using heavy armor, living off the land -- than a social group.  And I don't really think any other base class comes anywhere close to capturing those aspects, so I wouldn't want to leave the Barbarian class so off-limits.Sort of Tome of Battle.  But that would only be a part of it.  In my Fighter houserules, I gave a class discipline list (which grants full class level to IL for those disciplines and stacks with any adept classes for them, much as an adept prestige class would), a total of 4 gained maneuvers over the 20 levels (and at each point gaining 1 "readied" maneuver that can be recovered like a Warblade, all the rest can be used 1/encounter), and the ability to take Martial Study with Fighter bonus feats without it counting against the limit of 3 times.  So, if you wish to ignore Tome of Battle, the class forces little on you, and if you want ot focus on it, you can have all sorts of maneuvers and stances.  I felt it was important to not just make another adept class, but to keep the simplicity and ability to basically build any kind of Fighter you want with any revisions.I gave 4+ int skills and a better list, including some social skills.  Also gave martial lore and Knowledge (history) to all Fighter variations (see below).  I gave the Warblade's Weapon Aptitude, because Fighters should have it.  Doesn't really require Tome of Battle to understand, of course.  It's just the ability to switch around your weapon-based feats.That was "phase 1."  The latter two phases I have been too lazy to implement, and the second a bit apprehensive, because it might be too much.  The second is some free feat scaling, similar ot what Arcana Evolved has.  In other words, Weapon Focus would self-improve at Fighter 8, no need to take GWF.  In general, I wanted to offer some high level feat options in line power-wise for their level, but requiring very few things besides Fighter level.  In this way, they would become psuedo-class features.  I don't like that many high level Fighter feats require massive chains of prerequisites.  Fighters should just be able to get some cool ranged attack feat by being high level, even if they spent most of their feats prior on melee, for example.Phase 3 is making a subset of the Knowledge (history) skill called "Tactics."  Tactics would be a series of DCs to use in small group or large-scale combat to achieve various formations, which give mechanical benefits (or could possibly abstract warfare-level combat entirely).  Better tactics would have higher DCs.  You would both need to make the fixed DC and have a better check result than the enemy commander to defeat his formation.  I want the skill check to include BAB, probably half BAB, so it then relies on 1) having good BAB, 2) having it as a class skil lto put ranks in, and 3) having a good int.  Having some combination of those would make you the best at the skill, which would mean (in core) that the Wizard, Bard, and Fighter would be the best at Tactics, which IMHO seems appropriate.  Not even started yet, because man it's a lot of work to do!My Fighter variant and its two "kits" have been used frequently in the two groups they've been adopted by, and seem to be more fun and varied for players using them, even though for the standard Fighter, it's still not much for out-of combat options.  They are blatantly better thean core Fighters, but still slightly weaker than adept classes, I'd say.  Rules for them, if you want:[sblock]As in the PHB, except:• Class Skills: Climb (Str), Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Handle Animal (Cha), Intimidate (Cha), Jump (Str), Knowledge (History) (Int), Listen (Wis), Martial Lore (Int), Perform (Weapon Drill) (Cha), Profession (Wis), Ride (Dex), Spot (Wis), Swim (Str)• Skill points = 4 + Int modifier• Class Disciplines: DM, IH, SS, SD, TC, WR• Fighter levels count as full initiator levels for determining what stances and maneuvers can be chosen by the character for the above disciplines. Also, Fighter bonus feats spent on Martial Study (as well as maneuvers learned with the Martial Study class feature) do not count against the standard limit of how many times the feat may be taken (3).• Weapon Aptitude: Fighters can re-designate which weapons their weapons-related feats apply to each morning, see Warblade for more information.• 5th level – Versatile Learning: Ability scores count as 4 points higher and base save bonuses count as 2 points higher when meeting the prerequisites of a feat on the Fighter bonus feat list. This applies even if not actually acquiring the feat with a bonus feat slot.• 11th level – Shattering Strike: The Fighter may use a standard action to take a single attack at his highest attack bonus. This attack disregards 1 point of DR of the opponent per Fighter level. The effective DR does not go below zero.• 17th level – Greater Shattering Strike: Any attack the Fighter makes treats the opponent’s DR as 1 point lower per two Fighter levels, not reducing effective DR below zero. The Fighter may still use a standard action to do a single attack at the higher DR reduction rate.• Martial Study: At levels 3, 9, 15, and 19 a Fighter may learn one maneuver for which he meets the prerequisites (he may still take Martial Study as a Fighter bonus or regular feat). In addition, at each of these levels, the Fighter gains one maneuver readied. This allows the Fighter to ready maneuvers he has learned through Martial Study, so that he can recover them mid-battle as a swift action followed immediately by a melee attack or as a standard action, following all rules for recovering maneuvers (including the restriction of not using a maneuver that round). Note, for a Fighter with more maneuvers known than he can ready (and assuming no martial adept levels), any maneuvers not readied are available once per encounter, as normal. If the Fighter has actual martial adept levels, he instead adds to his total maneuvers readied, and may select a number of maneuvers to ready from his Martial Study feats equal to the bonus readied maneuvers this feature grants (i.e., 1 at Fighter 3, etc...). In this case, all the multiclassed Fighter’s maneuvers are recovered by whatever method the martial adept class follows. If the Fighter has more than one martial adept class, he must choose which one he will add the extra readied maneuver to each time he gains this feature.• Advanced Training: At levels 7 and 13 the Fighter learns special tactics and skills. He may choose any one Tactical or Weapon Style feat for which he meets the pre-requisites.Fighter variants:“Gladiator” Variant• d8 HD• Remove Armor Proficiency: Medium and Heavy, and Tower Shield Proficiency. Gladiators are proficient with the net.• Class Skills: Balance (Dex), Bluff (Cha), Craft (Int), Escape Artist (Dex), Gather Information (Cha), Heal (Wis), Intimidate (Cha), Jump (Str), Knowledge (History) (Int), Knowledge (Local) (Int), Listen (Wis), Martial Lore (Int), Perform (all) (Cha), Profession (Wis), Sense Motive (Wis), Sleight of Hand (Dex), Spot (Wis), Tumble (Dex), and Swim (Str).• Skill points = 6 + Int modifier• Class Disciplines: DW, IH, SS, SH, SD, TC, WR• Change “good” save from Fortitude to Reflex• Confident Defense: A gladiator can add his charisma modifier to AC as a dodge bonus while wearing light or no armor, to a maximum amount equal to his class levels. In order to gain this benefit, the gladiator must be fighting within 60 feet of three or more conscious allies whom he has line of effect to. He can also gain this benefit when fighting in front of a crowd or audience if the audience has a status of “Friendly” or better with him (see Diplomacy skill). Improving this status is a use of Perform (Weapon Drill) as normal, in addition to any other conditional effects the DM allows.• Starting with 2nd level bonus feat, a gladiator may choose to gain +1d6 Sneak Attack instead of a bonus feat at each even level (need not always be sneak attack).• 5th level – A gladiator gains Evasion, but only while wearing light or no armor. A helpless Gladiator loses the benefit of Evasion. This replaces the standard fighter’s 5th level ability.• At 11th and 17th levels, a Special Ability is gained from the Rogue Special Ability list. Alternatively, Uncanny Dodge (or Improved Uncanny Dodge if you already have the former) may be chosen. This replaces the standard Fighter’s 11th and 17th level abilities.“Court Champion” Variant• Class Skills: Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Handle Animal (Cha), Intimidate (Cha), Knowledge (History) (Int), Knowledge (Nobility and Royalty) (Int), Listen (Wis), Martial Lore (Int), Profession (Wis), Ride (Dex), Sense Motive (Wis), and Spot (Wis).• Change “good” save from Fortitude to Will.• Class Disciplines: DS, DM, IH, SS, SD, WR• At 5th level, the Fighter gains an Animal Companion, as a Druid, but any animal he chooses must be suitable as a mount. At levels 11 and 17, the animal companion gains a bonus feat of any kind it can meet the requirements for. The Court Champion variant loses the level 5, 11, and 17 class features.[/sblock]I also have really gotten into the idea of "personalized recovery mechanics" to add flavor to a character.  In my current game, one PC is a leader type, gestalt Bard/Warchanter // Gladiator variant, so I helped him come up with this for his recovery mechanic:Maneuver Recovery: "You exert your influence in battle to refresh your mind of spent maneuvers. A Tactician variant Gladiator can recover maneuvers on any round he makes an Intimidate or Diplomacy check for any reason by also expending a swift action. A Gladiator with this variant cannot use any maneuver on his turn that round if he does so, and the Diplomacy or Intimidate check has to be made during his turn, not out of turn via a reaction ability."Taken alone, it's weaker than standard Warblade.  But with feats and tactical feats to get move and even free-action Diplomacy/Intimidate checks, it will eventually be stronger, for him.  Currently he is level 6 and uses it most often with Intimidating Strike.  Next level, I think he's spending his tactical feat on Clarion Commander, giving another combination.</blockquote>

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