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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Avatar of the North" data-source="post: 74867" data-attributes="member: 917">lets see if i'm doing this correctly thenA Great Wyrm Gold Dragon (CR:26) would have a check of 31* x 1.5= DC:46.5*: CR: 26 +5 for a being very rare (great wyrms aren't laying around everywhere in the campaign......atleast you as players should hope not, Evil DM laughing)Now for an absolutely Absurd example (which will require epic level skill level checks <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /> )An Shadow, Axiomatic, Half-Water elemental, Half-Celestial Gold Great Wyrm Dragon with 10 levels of the Shifter prestige class would be (CR: 26+1+2+2+1+10=Final CR:42). This would make the check be the following then?47 x Creature type mod [x7]**=DC: 329*: *[CR: 42 +5 for stupidly rare and non-existant creature]** (Base of x3[shapeshifter or outsider]+4 for templates=final of x7)</blockquote>