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Message: <blockquote data-quote="fanboy2000" data-source="post: 6333710" data-attributes="member: 19998">Well, technically, there's no surprise round. Though I don't know if knowing that would have changed the way you ran the combat. Or if you do know it and simply used surprise round because that's been the nomenclature for 14 years.During the first round of combat, characters that are surprised (characters who don't notice any threat) don't get to act or take reactions until the next round. Characters that do notice a threat (any threat, if I'm reading it correctly) get their actions during combat as normal. Some members of the party maybe surprised, some not. Thus, you would go in infinitive order during the surprise round (really the first round of combat) just some characters would have their actions and some would not. So, for the Goblins to go the first round without any PC noticing would mean that they beat all the PCs passive perceptions. Alliteratively, since you roll once for groups of monsters, the Goblins could simply have won initiative in general. Worst case scenario, they beat all the PCs passive perceptions and win initiative, since surprised characters don't get actions until the second round, the Goblins get two attacks in before any PCs can act (though on the second round, PCs would get reactions.)Clearly, it's a tough combat. That the Goblins explicitly don't kill the PCs is pretty much there for the exact scenario you've encountered.</blockquote>