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Message: <blockquote data-quote="d12" data-source="post: 1055057" data-attributes="member: 657">Thanks for all of your replies, they have really been helpful.  I’ve never run a game at this high a level so this is new territory for me.First, a little background on my PCs.  The 15th level sorcerer is a svrifneblin.  So, his ECL is 18.  In addition to having limited wish, firebrand (errata version!), true seeing and a host of other powerful spells at his disposal, he also has an SR of 26 and about 104 hp plus his other svirfneblin powers.  He’s pretty tough thanks to a good draw on a deck of many things.The arcane archer does something like 1d8+11 damage at a minimum.  Against humans or within 30 feet he does more.  When he casts hunter’s mercy, he’s unreal.  He once killed a healthy beholder with one shot from around a corner (and that was 2 or 3 levels ago).These are only the two most powerful PCs.  The others aren’t shabby either – a cleric, a druid (with awakened tiger companion) and a fighter.Lately, I’ve come to realize that this group isn’t challenged at all by creatures of CR equal to their level.  Last week they took out:CR 16 – no problem2 CR 15s in one combat – no problemIt wasn’t even interesting.  The players are smart and the PCs can do so many things and absorb so much damage.So now they’ve come to Thay.  When they came through the portal to Thay, they took out 4 minor wizards and 8 guards in one round.  The Red Wizard “in charge” of the portal came in from the next room in time to join the battle along with his nightmare beast.  He saw first hand just how quickly the PCs took out the guards, the nightmare beast and then chased him off [and he had a host of protective spells up].  He knows the PCs are capable of powerful magic and are deadly fighters to boot.  So, he teleports off to find his two business associates – another 15th level red wizard and a 16th level cleric.  Wizard #1:  Hey guys, some very powerful group just came through our portal.  They killed the nightmare beast and all the guards.  They almost killed me.  This is bad.  If anyone finds out, our reputations will be ruined.Wizard #2:  We’ve got to stop them now but we’ve got to be quiet about it.  Cost is no object.Cleric: I’ll go ask my god to send us some “quiet” help.  It will be expensive but we have to preserve our venture.So, the cleric can bring out up to 24 HD of outsiders with a Greater Planar ally spell.  What he gets are two 12-HD Kelevzu – each a CR 18.  The 2 Kelevzu get buffing spells from the cleric and wizards [improved invisibility, stoneskin, bull’s str, endurance, owl’s wisdom, cat’s grace, protection from elements] and take off via teleport without error to go clean house.  I think this will be a very tough encounter for the PCs.  It might be too much but they might also pull it off.  If things are going badly, there are two PCs that can teleport the entire party away.  I’m not doing this because the PCs went somewhere I wasn’t expecting.  I’m doing this because Red Wizards are evil, nasty cowards who believe in overkill.  I want the players to get a feeling that they’ve stepped somewhere challenging to say the least.  They might relish the challenge, loot some of Tyraturos and go home.  Maybe they’ll stage a slave revolt.  Maybe they’ll quickly explore the building they are in and go home before the Kelevzu even arrive (which will take 12-15 minutes).  I’d be happy with any of those as long as my players are having fun.  I’m not trying to kill the PCs – the Red Wizards are.  And, even if I was trying to knock off a few PCs…. Well, death is only an inconvenience at this level.  They are a few True Resurrections from being back in the game.</blockquote>

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