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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Fanaelialae" data-source="post: 6651345" data-attributes="member: 53980">It sounds to me like your players really want to play Pathfinder. It's just my opinion, but the vibe I got from that critique was that of someone who doesn't want to like 5e. As others here have stated, you might be better off letting one of them take over GMing Pathfinder, rather than trying to "force" them to enjoy 5e.That said, here are a few ideas on making 5e a bit more like Pathfinder, on the off chance that that's all it would take.Instead of picking Backgrounds from the list, let them pick 2 appropriate skills and 2 appropriate languages/tools. Also work with them on some RP benefit befitting their concept (as an alternative, you could replace that with 13th Age's One Special Thing). Forget about Ideals, Bonds, and Traits. I don't think they were meant for wargamers (who'd be likely to ignore them) but rather fledgling role-players, who might find it useful to have a simple framework in place for guiding how their character should behave. Instead, just have them write a background and use that. When they role-play well, grant them Inspiration. Or if they simply don't like Inspiration, just drop it completely. It won't break anything.Next, give the players things to spend gold on. A simple option, which might appeal to those who like Pathfinder, is to come up with a short list of magic items that are available for sale in a location. Depending on the nature of your campaign, the PCs might need to make an effort (digging up rumors, tracking down shady black marketeers, etc) to find out what's available. The DMG has rough guidelines for prices by rarity, and you can adjust that up or down based on circumstances. It seems like your player was saying he'd like to see more magic items. It might make the game a bit easier, but you can always make encounters more difficult to compensate, so I'd say increase the availability of magic items overall.The reality is that it would be basically impossible for a game that's only existed for one year to compete with a game that's been pumping out new options for 15 years in terms of options. That said, you can find plenty of fan generated content here on ENWorld (go to Resources in the menu and click Databases) and elsewhere. You need to look them over with a critical eye and adjust them sometimes, but it can help quickly expand the options available. Odds are, however, you won't come near the breadth of Pathfinder, but you can definitely expand the available feat, races and archetypes by doing so.Point out to them that "rulings not rules" is just the equivalent of Rule 0, albeit a bit more 1e in its philosophy. Unless I'm somehow imagining a 300+ page PHB filled mostly with rules sitting next to me. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" />Overall though, it doesn't seem to me that these changes would make the difference. If they want to play Pathfinder, then that's the way it is. At least they were willing to try playing 5e.</blockquote>

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