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My players want Human Centric
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<blockquote data-quote="Mercule" data-source="post: 6915066" data-attributes="member: 5100"><p>I have to say, [MENTION=57914]GameOgre[/MENTION], I'm kinda with your players. I much, much prefer human-centric settings. Humans ground a setting and give it that anchor of relatability that actually allows the other races to be interesting. That isn't to say that I wouldn't play in or run a campaign that focused on or only included some other race. Just that I expect there to be justification for it.</p><p></p><p>That justification doesn't have to be extreme, but it does have to exist. Take, for example, classic pseudo-Medieval European D&D vs. Oriental Adventures (sake of same ruleset). I <u>prefer</u> the stock D&D tropes, but don't hate OA. If you want to run a full-on OA game, I'm actually probably going to be all for it because it's a little different and unique -- assuming this isn't intended to be an indefinite shift of the group's focus (i.e. I'm in for 12-18 months; one campaign). Why? Because I'm open to trying different things. I'm going to have expectations, though, of the game being steeped in Eastern flavor. If you end up describing a setting that smells a lot like near-Renaissance France/Italy, except that everyone has Japanese features and katanas roxxors, I'm going to be frustrated because there's no reason to call it out as an OA game.</p><p></p><p>Likewise, if you're doing an all-elf game, I expect it to feel a lot different from a human-centric game. I want to be reminded -- a lot -- that we couldn't have done this game with humans. If it's sans-human for the simple sake of being sans-human, but otherwise plays the same as it would if the main race was human, then you're flipping a lever for no value and I'd actually say it actively diminishes my respect for the game.</p><p></p><p>All that said, as I reread your post, I don't see anything that would specifically throw me off -- especially if the focus of play was still human-centric (i.e. the PCs were the underdog races). Even if the PCs were elven, incorporating the long life into the campaign theme makes it <u>different</u> and gives a reason for the racial difference.</p><p></p><p>I find it strange when people talk about "racism" in regard to fictional critters. Elves don't exist. They're a genre trope that some people don't like. I find the idea of a race of short thieves with high natural curiosity and almost no sense of self-preservation to be absurd. That doesn't mean I'm a bigot. It means I don't like the element in my fiction. To switch modes, I find the idea of magic powered by subjective reality to be ridiculous and strongly dislike it, but some folks like it. There's nothing in there that reflects on anything beyond personal taste. </p><p></p><p>Elves have long been portrayed as over-powered and Mary Sue characters. I ignore that and actually kinda like elves, but it really puts a bad taste in some folks' mouths. Both elves and dwarves could be seen as "tired tropes" in the genre. Maybe part of the problem is that your group actually wants something even more different. What if you reskinned the elves as dragonborn? Nothing says dragonborn can't live for millennia.</p><p></p><p>Of course, it could all come down to a mis-match of tastes, for the group. I've had <em>Aces & Eights</em> sitting on my shelf since the first printing. I think it looks like a blast, but everyone else in my group is adamantly opposed to westerns. It sucks, and I could complain about my group's tastes and/or their unwillingness to get outside their comfort zone. The reality is, though, there's sufficient overlap in what we all consider "fun" that we're enjoying ourselves and have years and years of enjoyment left in D&D, WoD, Champions, and Shadowrun. Life is too short.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Mercule, post: 6915066, member: 5100"] I have to say, [MENTION=57914]GameOgre[/MENTION], I'm kinda with your players. I much, much prefer human-centric settings. Humans ground a setting and give it that anchor of relatability that actually allows the other races to be interesting. That isn't to say that I wouldn't play in or run a campaign that focused on or only included some other race. Just that I expect there to be justification for it. That justification doesn't have to be extreme, but it does have to exist. Take, for example, classic pseudo-Medieval European D&D vs. Oriental Adventures (sake of same ruleset). I [U]prefer[/U] the stock D&D tropes, but don't hate OA. If you want to run a full-on OA game, I'm actually probably going to be all for it because it's a little different and unique -- assuming this isn't intended to be an indefinite shift of the group's focus (i.e. I'm in for 12-18 months; one campaign). Why? Because I'm open to trying different things. I'm going to have expectations, though, of the game being steeped in Eastern flavor. If you end up describing a setting that smells a lot like near-Renaissance France/Italy, except that everyone has Japanese features and katanas roxxors, I'm going to be frustrated because there's no reason to call it out as an OA game. Likewise, if you're doing an all-elf game, I expect it to feel a lot different from a human-centric game. I want to be reminded -- a lot -- that we couldn't have done this game with humans. If it's sans-human for the simple sake of being sans-human, but otherwise plays the same as it would if the main race was human, then you're flipping a lever for no value and I'd actually say it actively diminishes my respect for the game. All that said, as I reread your post, I don't see anything that would specifically throw me off -- especially if the focus of play was still human-centric (i.e. the PCs were the underdog races). Even if the PCs were elven, incorporating the long life into the campaign theme makes it [U]different[/U] and gives a reason for the racial difference. I find it strange when people talk about "racism" in regard to fictional critters. Elves don't exist. They're a genre trope that some people don't like. I find the idea of a race of short thieves with high natural curiosity and almost no sense of self-preservation to be absurd. That doesn't mean I'm a bigot. It means I don't like the element in my fiction. To switch modes, I find the idea of magic powered by subjective reality to be ridiculous and strongly dislike it, but some folks like it. There's nothing in there that reflects on anything beyond personal taste. Elves have long been portrayed as over-powered and Mary Sue characters. I ignore that and actually kinda like elves, but it really puts a bad taste in some folks' mouths. Both elves and dwarves could be seen as "tired tropes" in the genre. Maybe part of the problem is that your group actually wants something even more different. What if you reskinned the elves as dragonborn? Nothing says dragonborn can't live for millennia. Of course, it could all come down to a mis-match of tastes, for the group. I've had [I]Aces & Eights[/I] sitting on my shelf since the first printing. I think it looks like a blast, but everyone else in my group is adamantly opposed to westerns. It sucks, and I could complain about my group's tastes and/or their unwillingness to get outside their comfort zone. The reality is, though, there's sufficient overlap in what we all consider "fun" that we're enjoying ourselves and have years and years of enjoyment left in D&D, WoD, Champions, and Shadowrun. Life is too short. [/QUOTE]
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