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*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Narrative Space Options for non-spellcasters
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<blockquote data-quote="Starfox" data-source="post: 6151491" data-attributes="member: 2303"><p>It depends on playstyle, of course, but in my opionion a good DM can give good players alot of control. And I don't really see that there is a big difference between magical and mundane narrative control here.</p><p></p><p>In a sandbox control, the DM is giving out a lot of control almost by default. </p><p></p><p>In a story game, once the players have picked up on the story, they should be interested in pursuing said story. As long as that is what they do, the DM can give them a lot of narrative control. The issue only comes up if the players want to derail the story. And if they really want to do that, no amount of DM control can really prevent it - it is a table issue, not a game issue. An example happened to me in Dragonlance Module 2 - the PCs are in an inn when the agents of evil bust the door. Instead of fighting the, and leading the villagers to safety, the cleric player wanted to use Plane Shift and to go heaven to avoid the problem. Well, let's just say the angels in the reception were NOT pleased. Another example was in the first part of the Skull & Shackles adventure path; the players are supposed to strike back against bullying officers, but the party fighter has no problem with the oppressive system and suffered in quiet, remaining a loyal underling. It really takes no magic to dodge a linear plot.</p><p></p><p>In kick in the door style play, I suppose the DM wants to confine narrative control to the dungeon. If the players want to rewrite the rules of the locale, the DM might be able to roll with it, but sometimes will want to say no. And this applies to spells and other abilities equally. For example, in a trapped kobold warren, using Control Water to drown the entire warren might be just as bad as using the mundane power to call a mob of peasants to "clear" all the traps by triggering them. Overall, this kind of play style probably has the least room for narrative control, but that applies equally to spells and other abilities.</p><p></p><p><strong>Edit:</strong> <a href="http://yamara.com/2005/08/29/kids/" target="_blank">Abusing actor stance powers?</a></p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Starfox, post: 6151491, member: 2303"] It depends on playstyle, of course, but in my opionion a good DM can give good players alot of control. And I don't really see that there is a big difference between magical and mundane narrative control here. In a sandbox control, the DM is giving out a lot of control almost by default. In a story game, once the players have picked up on the story, they should be interested in pursuing said story. As long as that is what they do, the DM can give them a lot of narrative control. The issue only comes up if the players want to derail the story. And if they really want to do that, no amount of DM control can really prevent it - it is a table issue, not a game issue. An example happened to me in Dragonlance Module 2 - the PCs are in an inn when the agents of evil bust the door. Instead of fighting the, and leading the villagers to safety, the cleric player wanted to use Plane Shift and to go heaven to avoid the problem. Well, let's just say the angels in the reception were NOT pleased. Another example was in the first part of the Skull & Shackles adventure path; the players are supposed to strike back against bullying officers, but the party fighter has no problem with the oppressive system and suffered in quiet, remaining a loyal underling. It really takes no magic to dodge a linear plot. In kick in the door style play, I suppose the DM wants to confine narrative control to the dungeon. If the players want to rewrite the rules of the locale, the DM might be able to roll with it, but sometimes will want to say no. And this applies to spells and other abilities equally. For example, in a trapped kobold warren, using Control Water to drown the entire warren might be just as bad as using the mundane power to call a mob of peasants to "clear" all the traps by triggering them. Overall, this kind of play style probably has the least room for narrative control, but that applies equally to spells and other abilities. [b]Edit:[/b] [url=http://yamara.com/2005/08/29/kids/]Abusing actor stance powers?[/url] [/QUOTE]
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Narrative Space Options for non-spellcasters
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