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General Tabletop Discussion
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Natural Weapons, How Much Value Is There To Actually Having Them?
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<blockquote data-quote="James Gasik" data-source="post: 9189535" data-attributes="member: 6877472"><p>Ok, so I'll start with my review of the race as it was printed in Volo's. At this time, there was no flexible ASI's. We have a Con/Wis race that has the following abilities:</p><p></p><p>30' Swim Speed (not bad, but I'll get back to this).</p><p></p><p>A Natural Weapon (topic of this thread).</p><p></p><p>Cunning Artisan, which allows you to, if you already have a dagger or artisan's tools to create a weapon that doesn't do any more damage than your Bite, or a Shield during a short rest. You can also make a few darts or blowgun needles (but you can't make a blowgun). I don't know that there's any reason to use a blowgun in the first place, so I can't say how useful that is. You can save anyone in your party that uses a shield 10gp though!</p><p></p><p>(There is an argument for selling your weapons to make gold- if your DM allows this, it might help you defray the cost for your healing potion budget, but you should get enough gold from adventuring for this to be a trivial benefit).</p><p></p><p>Hold Breath. Going to get back to this one too.</p><p></p><p>Hunter's Lore: ok, free skill proficiency is fine, especially with the option for Perception.</p><p></p><p>Natural Armor: so you basically get free Mage Armor/+1 Studded Leather. Recall that this wasn't created to be a Dexterity race, so you're not likely getting any better AC than a race with a bonus to Dexterity, and as Con/Wis, the classes you're most likely going to select probably have access to better armor.</p><p></p><p>Hungry Jaws I discussed already, a 1/long rest bonus action attack that gives out a few temps. Not great.</p><p></p><p>So what about that swim speed? Well, in the same book,. we get the Triton.</p><p></p><p>Str/Con/Cha race.</p><p></p><p>Same Swim Speed. </p><p></p><p>Can cast Fog Cloud/Gust of Wind/Wall of Water 1/long rest.</p><p></p><p>Can actually breathe underwater.</p><p></p><p>Can communicate with any water breathing creature.</p><p></p><p>Resistance to cold and immunity to "any of the drawbacks caused by a deep, underwater environment" (I'm assuming their talking about pressure damage or the bends).</p><p></p><p>Even if communicating with water breathing creatures and resistance to the bends are ribbons, I'd argue that the communication is a better ribbon than a d6 bite or the ability to make a club.</p><p></p><p>Breathing underwater trumps holding one's breath in most cases.</p><p></p><p>Resistance to Cold is always useful no matter what level you are.</p><p></p><p>And instead of a 1/long rest attack, you get an actual spell. Sure, Fog Cloud is generally only good for running away, and I've never see Gust of Wind have a particularly good use, but Wall of Water gives ranged attacks disadvantage and protects you from fire, so I'm going to say this is way better.</p><p></p><p>No free skill proficiency though.</p><p></p><p>And this is two races in the same book! If you're choosing a race by what it gives you, then Triton is a superior choice most of the time. And if you're choosing a race based on roleplay concerns, well, here's the other reason I hate the Lizardfolk:</p><p>[ATTACH=full]325817[/ATTACH]</p><p>A guy who lacks emotion and empathy and looks at me the same way I look at a steak- why would I want to go on a dangerous adventure with him again?</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="James Gasik, post: 9189535, member: 6877472"] Ok, so I'll start with my review of the race as it was printed in Volo's. At this time, there was no flexible ASI's. We have a Con/Wis race that has the following abilities: 30' Swim Speed (not bad, but I'll get back to this). A Natural Weapon (topic of this thread). Cunning Artisan, which allows you to, if you already have a dagger or artisan's tools to create a weapon that doesn't do any more damage than your Bite, or a Shield during a short rest. You can also make a few darts or blowgun needles (but you can't make a blowgun). I don't know that there's any reason to use a blowgun in the first place, so I can't say how useful that is. You can save anyone in your party that uses a shield 10gp though! (There is an argument for selling your weapons to make gold- if your DM allows this, it might help you defray the cost for your healing potion budget, but you should get enough gold from adventuring for this to be a trivial benefit). Hold Breath. Going to get back to this one too. Hunter's Lore: ok, free skill proficiency is fine, especially with the option for Perception. Natural Armor: so you basically get free Mage Armor/+1 Studded Leather. Recall that this wasn't created to be a Dexterity race, so you're not likely getting any better AC than a race with a bonus to Dexterity, and as Con/Wis, the classes you're most likely going to select probably have access to better armor. Hungry Jaws I discussed already, a 1/long rest bonus action attack that gives out a few temps. Not great. So what about that swim speed? Well, in the same book,. we get the Triton. Str/Con/Cha race. Same Swim Speed. Can cast Fog Cloud/Gust of Wind/Wall of Water 1/long rest. Can actually breathe underwater. Can communicate with any water breathing creature. Resistance to cold and immunity to "any of the drawbacks caused by a deep, underwater environment" (I'm assuming their talking about pressure damage or the bends). Even if communicating with water breathing creatures and resistance to the bends are ribbons, I'd argue that the communication is a better ribbon than a d6 bite or the ability to make a club. Breathing underwater trumps holding one's breath in most cases. Resistance to Cold is always useful no matter what level you are. And instead of a 1/long rest attack, you get an actual spell. Sure, Fog Cloud is generally only good for running away, and I've never see Gust of Wind have a particularly good use, but Wall of Water gives ranged attacks disadvantage and protects you from fire, so I'm going to say this is way better. No free skill proficiency though. And this is two races in the same book! If you're choosing a race by what it gives you, then Triton is a superior choice most of the time. And if you're choosing a race based on roleplay concerns, well, here's the other reason I hate the Lizardfolk: [ATTACH type="full"]325817[/ATTACH] A guy who lacks emotion and empathy and looks at me the same way I look at a steak- why would I want to go on a dangerous adventure with him again? [/QUOTE]
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