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Message: <blockquote data-quote="irdeggman" data-source="post: 4744963" data-attributes="member: 16285">All ranged attacked must be made with a ranged (or thrown) weapon - see my earlier PHB and RC references.  Essentially they are the same thing since also all attacks with ranged (or thrown) weapons are ranged attacks.False premise.Both this argument and the one in the thread on being prone assumes that the defining statement for when a rogue can make a sneak attack is when an opponent is unable to defend himself effectively.  When in fact the definition is for only 2 conditions:(1) When the opponent is denied a Dex bonus to AC(2) When the rogue flanks the opponent.Now if one looks at the text in Complete Adventurer..Under Ninja's Sudden Strike (pg 8)So since we have 2 definitions of when an opponent is unable to defend himself effectively from an attack.(1) When they are denied a Dex Bonus to AC or when the attacker flanks the target (from the rogue class ability)(2) When they are denied a Dex Bonus to AC (from the ninja class ability)Which is the correct one?The intro statement on the opponent not being able to effectivel defend themself is the lead in to the specific conditions that the ability applies in relation to each of the two class' abilities and these conditions are different.</blockquote>