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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Scotley" data-source="post: 1962899" data-attributes="member: 11520">First let's address some specific spells. Discern Location—Must have seen the creature or have something that belonged to it. If no one saw the crime and no possessions were left behind this spell will not help.Find the Path—Useless unless the Priest’s know where the killer or a clue can be found. True seeing—Only a concern if the killer is still in the area and hidden using illusion, polymorph or hiding in a secret room, etc. Commune—This one could be tricky if the players are good at 20 questions. This is where you may have to be a bit heavy handed. Perhaps this power is available only to the barer of the divine spark. That would be logical. Another take is that church has an oracle that is the keeper of this power and either it is only available at certain times or perhaps the God is angry at his followers for letting his chosen be slain and is giving them the silent treatment. Maybe the deity simply isn’t omniscient and doesn’t have the answers to give—a possibility suggested in the spells description. With a little thought I think you can overcome this one without frustrating the players too much. Discern Lies—Only a problem if the killer or an accomplice is still around and suspect. It is unlikely that they would question everyone in the temple under this spell.Zone of Truth—As Discern Lies, unless someone who knows something is available for questioning and they are questioning everyone this is not a concern. Augury—Heavy use of the spell might help the investigators avoid following some useless leads and help them stay on the right track, but it shouldn’t ruin the mystery. Scrying/Greater Scrying—again these spells are of little use without some physical evidence left behind or a suspect that is known to the caster. The bad guy should have a strong will save if they are likely to figure out who it is early on. Minor detection spells (Detect evil, detect magic, detect invisible, etc.)—These are again unlikely to be a problem unless the killer is still readily available for the investigators to try their spells on. Some magic items can limit the accuracy of these spells and should be available to the bad guys. Are there other spells in particular that you are concerned about? I just skimmed the SRD and these are the ones that jumped out at me as potential problems. Next, since I've largely addressed the divinations lets ponder how the party gets involved. The most obvious answer is that they are the resources of the church, clerics, paladins, monks, maybe even druids or rangers and otherwise faithful who have some experience with this sort of thing. Just because the other clerics are higher level doesn't mean that they are particularly good at solving mysteries or using divination spells to this sort of effect. Not all clerics are adventurers at heart. Other party members can be friends of those with a direct tie to the church.  Or they could owe the church some service for past help such as healing or raising a relative from the dead or givin the nature of the deity preventing a flood or ending a drought. The next option is that the church is trying to keep this disaster a secret for the time being. The players are either trusted or the church has some hold over them that ensures they won't talk. Maybe they were just in the wrong place at the wrong time and thus know about the high priest's murder and thus are enlisted to help solve the crime rather than tell someone else who doesn't already know. Maybe some of the party members were on guard at the time of the murder or happened to overhear someone discussing it. Finally, and this one is tricky, make the players somehow at fault. Then make them solve the mystery to atone. I once tricked the party into helping a thief of a powerful artifact escape the rightful authorities. Then they were tried and sentenced to solve the crime under a Geas. I knew the players well and was pretty sure I could get them to fall for it and they did, but it will be difficult and might be too much of a gamble with an online group you don't really know, especially if one of them is reading this right now.  <img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/smilies/paranoid.png"  class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":uhoh:" title="Paranoid    :uhoh:" data-shortname=":uhoh:" /> You don't have to take divination completely out of it. The church may have already done some divining and the initial clues you give the party could come from that, or if they get way off track later you might want to give them a nudge back in the right direction with some information the church has gleaned from the latest round of spells. This might make it feel more believable and less like you are taking DM's fiat with the spells. Anyway, hope this helps. It sounds like an intersting plot. I don't think its been done before in a published adventure, but there is a lot of stuff out there. Good luck!</blockquote>

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