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<blockquote data-quote="Jhyrryl" data-source="post: 1121452" data-attributes="member: 6406">Then I really have to agree with the camp that says not to take Improved Initiative.&nbsp; +4 to initiative when you're already getting +8 or more from Dex at mid to high levels is practically meaningless, unless you're going up against a creature that also has improved initiative and a high Dex.&nbsp; Waiting for other people to go and then putting yourself into a flanking position is much more efficient than trying to guarantee that you go first.&nbsp;If you're really going the spy route, try something other than a combat feat.&nbsp; Alertness probably isn't it, but maybe consider taking Magical Aptitude and train in Use Magic Device.&nbsp; You'll be able to use any wand w/o failure by your early teens - sooner with a Charisma item.&nbsp; And trust me, there's a lot of cool wands for a spy to be using.&nbsp;But if you must go combat, Point Blank Shot is your long-term friend.&nbsp; If you're unsure about long-term play, go Weapon Finesse and don't be afraid to tumble into melee (just watch out for the friendly-fire fireballs if you go too quickly).&nbsp; But a word of warning - if your party has a strong melee-warrior type (possibly a cleric) and a wizard or sorc, you're going to find your rogue to be a non-factor in roughly half the significant fights you encounter by mid-levels.&nbsp; Between immunities to sneak attacks, creatures that stay outside your sneak attack range, and the sheer ability of your combat oriented peers to eliminate weak opponents en masse, you'll be happy to get more than one significantly damaging hit in per encounter.&nbsp; Better to make sure your non-combat rogue-only time is at peak performance, IMO.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Jhyrryl, post: 1121452, member: 6406"] Then I really have to agree with the camp that says [b]not[/b] to take Improved Initiative. +4 to initiative when you're already getting +8 or more from Dex at mid to high levels is practically meaningless, unless you're going up against a creature that also has improved initiative and a high Dex. Waiting for other people to go and then putting yourself into a flanking position is much more efficient than trying to guarantee that you go first. If you're really going the spy route, try something other than a combat feat. Alertness probably isn't it, but maybe consider taking Magical Aptitude and train in Use Magic Device. You'll be able to use any wand w/o failure by your early teens - sooner with a Charisma item. And trust me, there's a lot of cool wands for a spy to be using. But if you must go combat, Point Blank Shot is your long-term friend. If you're unsure about long-term play, go Weapon Finesse and don't be afraid to tumble into melee (just watch out for the friendly-fire [i]fireballs[/i] if you go too quickly). But a word of warning - if your party has a strong melee-warrior type (possibly a cleric) and a wizard or sorc, you're going to find your rogue to be a non-factor in roughly half the significant fights you encounter by mid-levels. Between immunities to sneak attacks, creatures that stay outside your sneak attack range, and the sheer ability of your combat oriented peers to eliminate weak opponents en masse, you'll be happy to get more than one significantly damaging hit in per encounter. Better to make sure your non-combat rogue-only time is at peak performance, IMO. [/QUOTE]

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