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Nerfing Wizards the Old Fashioned Way: Magic User in 1e
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<blockquote data-quote="Hussar" data-source="post: 8085377" data-attributes="member: 22779"><p>Retributive strike was an effect of Staff of Power or Staff of the Magi only. It did not apply to wands. </p><p></p><p>And, again, that's been my point all the way along here. Outriders and pets were pretty much SOP in any group I played in for years. I was actually quite shocked once I moved away from home and started playing with strangers that people didn't use them. </p><p></p><p>But, when people are making blanket statements about "the way the game was", they're ignoring the fact that the game didn't have to be the way they played. When I said that Temple of Elemental Evil had over FIFTY magic items, that was by the time you had completed the second dungeon level. Not even the nodes. For reference, I hightly, HIGHLY recommend reading: <a href="https://www.enworld.org/threads/treasure-and-leveling-comparisons-ad-d1-b-ed-d-and-d-d3-updated-11-17-08-q1.167628/" target="_blank">Treasure and leveling comparisons: AD&D1, B/ED&D, and D&D3 - updated 11-17-08 (Q1)</a>. [USER=3854]@Quasqueton[/USER] nicely lists out all the magic items that were possible to retrieve in the modules. </p><p></p><p>So, when you talk about how 1e "nerfed" MU's, it really does depend so heavily on the group. In a group which screwed over it's MU's by not giving them the best protection items (giving rings of protection to the fighter? Seriously?), didn't take advantage of hirelings/henchmen, and the amount of magical loot that was found by the group, would radically alter the experience of an MU in the group. For us, most of the issues you guys have listed were not serious issues. The MU often had the best or second best AC in the group by higher levels. Certainly the best saving throws. Best protection and whatnot. Survivabilty? MU's almost always the last to die in our groups.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Hussar, post: 8085377, member: 22779"] Retributive strike was an effect of Staff of Power or Staff of the Magi only. It did not apply to wands. And, again, that's been my point all the way along here. Outriders and pets were pretty much SOP in any group I played in for years. I was actually quite shocked once I moved away from home and started playing with strangers that people didn't use them. But, when people are making blanket statements about "the way the game was", they're ignoring the fact that the game didn't have to be the way they played. When I said that Temple of Elemental Evil had over FIFTY magic items, that was by the time you had completed the second dungeon level. Not even the nodes. For reference, I hightly, HIGHLY recommend reading: [URL="https://www.enworld.org/threads/treasure-and-leveling-comparisons-ad-d1-b-ed-d-and-d-d3-updated-11-17-08-q1.167628/"]Treasure and leveling comparisons: AD&D1, B/ED&D, and D&D3 - updated 11-17-08 (Q1)[/URL]. [USER=3854]@Quasqueton[/USER] nicely lists out all the magic items that were possible to retrieve in the modules. So, when you talk about how 1e "nerfed" MU's, it really does depend so heavily on the group. In a group which screwed over it's MU's by not giving them the best protection items (giving rings of protection to the fighter? Seriously?), didn't take advantage of hirelings/henchmen, and the amount of magical loot that was found by the group, would radically alter the experience of an MU in the group. For us, most of the issues you guys have listed were not serious issues. The MU often had the best or second best AC in the group by higher levels. Certainly the best saving throws. Best protection and whatnot. Survivabilty? MU's almost always the last to die in our groups. [/QUOTE]
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