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<blockquote data-quote="Grabuto138" data-source="post: 5376609" data-attributes="member: 61053"><p>Shidaku, I sympathize with your feelings. I have played D&D for many years. I have an emotional and personal investment in the game that transcends every other hobby I have. Yet I spend more on baking, Xbox games, alcohol, tobacco and film (Netflix, Redbox and cable) than I do D&D. I appreciate that most people do not have this level of personal investement. But given the actual numbers we are talking I can't help but think that a lot of the bile being directed at WOTC is something akin to the annoyance you feel when your neighbor finally gets around to adding security to their wi-fi. The $100 for the DDI is roughly akin to 4 books a years. The original CB model is so completely out of whack for the value that I honestly felt quilty. "You mean I don't actually have to buy the Psionic book? You will just give the releveant content for like $10 bucks? The same 10 bucks I am already giving you?" Sold.</p><p> </p><p>And let's be honest here. If you are not in the financial position to either subscribe to the DDI or buy the books you are not actually a customer by any meaningful definition. You are the dude who buys one cup of coffee at the coffee shop and squats at a table for 8 hours using the wi-fi. The servers hate you, the real customers hate you and the company hates. But you are technically playing by the rules so screw 'em.</p><p> </p><p>I think that maybe some of this attitude stems from the fact that WOTC is owned by Hasbro. The assumption is that since there are bunch of corporate fat cats behind the game they don't need the money, they have the financial support to make things works, and since it is a faceless corporation who really cares if they get their chicken?</p><p> </p><p>The problem is that since D&D is part of the Hasbro family it is more important for the future of the game that they make some money. A public company like Hasbro has to answer to a Board of Directors and shareholders every quarter at least. Private companies are better positioned to sacrifice for the long-term and they can, perish the thought, even choose to undermine their own profits for the good of the hobby or the customer. Public companies cannot do that. They are, in fact, ethically obligated to maximize profits. </p><p> </p><p>Hasbro did not, in my opinion, buy D&D. They bought Magic and the CCG empire of WOTC. From my experience in corporate board rooms I am quite sure that there was some talk during the acquisition of how D&D can be monetized. "We will make toys, movies, board games, coloring books etc." But D&D was probably irrelevant to the equation. But now every few months some dude in an expensive suit summons a WOTC person to his office and demands that the WOTC person justifies the existence of D&D. Under TSR, GG and friends were probably happy with a steady wage doing what they love. Hasbro has to make sure that there is a return on investment that justifies the expense and risk. </p><p> </p><p>Keep in mind that money has alternative uses. Every dollar spent on D&D is a dollar that is not spent on My Little Poney, Transformers, GI Joe or Monoply: The Joliet State Penitentiary Edition (try the cabbage rolls). So every dollar that WOTC spends is a dollar that someone in the D&D unit fought for with the promise that there will be a return on investment that approximates the return if it were spent on some other endeavor. But post-'80's D&D has been frustrating hard to monetize. That appalling train wreck of a film pretty much guarantees that no one is going to risk real money trying to build a film franchise. I guess they are trying a comic book but I can't really think of an example where D&D has expanded beyond its core audience, an audience that is so small as to be mostly irrelevant to a company like Hasbro.</p><p> </p><p>Maybe some of it is due to an anti-corporate sentiment that I have detected from a few people. Since my 401k, the 403bs of the teachers in my group and the pensions of union gamers are tied up in investments in corporations (where else does one invest, really?) some of us rather hope that corporate American manages to make some money here and there. Our retirements depend on it.</p><p> </p><p>Finally, (and my apologies to that one person who has managed to read all the way through) the opposition to the new-model CB are so regressive that I have trouble believing the are all in good faith. I mean, everying is moving to the "cloud." In fact the "cloud" has become an annoying marketing buzzword. Back in the day, NetWare pimping the fact that NDS lived in the cloud was cool. Now, I am waiting for Proctor and Gamble to start pimping tampons that provide feminine hygeine in the cloud. Of course WOTC is moving to this model. The whole freaking world is moving to this model. You really honestly and truelly expect that WOTC is going to start marketing a product saying, "'90's tech like you know and love. All the data residing comfortably on your computer." Give me a freaking break.</p><p> </p><p>Edit: Some spelling, though probably not enough.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Grabuto138, post: 5376609, member: 61053"] Shidaku, I sympathize with your feelings. I have played D&D for many years. I have an emotional and personal investment in the game that transcends every other hobby I have. Yet I spend more on baking, Xbox games, alcohol, tobacco and film (Netflix, Redbox and cable) than I do D&D. I appreciate that most people do not have this level of personal investement. But given the actual numbers we are talking I can't help but think that a lot of the bile being directed at WOTC is something akin to the annoyance you feel when your neighbor finally gets around to adding security to their wi-fi. The $100 for the DDI is roughly akin to 4 books a years. The original CB model is so completely out of whack for the value that I honestly felt quilty. "You mean I don't actually have to buy the Psionic book? You will just give the releveant content for like $10 bucks? The same 10 bucks I am already giving you?" Sold. And let's be honest here. If you are not in the financial position to either subscribe to the DDI or buy the books you are not actually a customer by any meaningful definition. You are the dude who buys one cup of coffee at the coffee shop and squats at a table for 8 hours using the wi-fi. The servers hate you, the real customers hate you and the company hates. But you are technically playing by the rules so screw 'em. I think that maybe some of this attitude stems from the fact that WOTC is owned by Hasbro. The assumption is that since there are bunch of corporate fat cats behind the game they don't need the money, they have the financial support to make things works, and since it is a faceless corporation who really cares if they get their chicken? The problem is that since D&D is part of the Hasbro family it is more important for the future of the game that they make some money. A public company like Hasbro has to answer to a Board of Directors and shareholders every quarter at least. Private companies are better positioned to sacrifice for the long-term and they can, perish the thought, even choose to undermine their own profits for the good of the hobby or the customer. Public companies cannot do that. They are, in fact, ethically obligated to maximize profits. Hasbro did not, in my opinion, buy D&D. They bought Magic and the CCG empire of WOTC. From my experience in corporate board rooms I am quite sure that there was some talk during the acquisition of how D&D can be monetized. "We will make toys, movies, board games, coloring books etc." But D&D was probably irrelevant to the equation. But now every few months some dude in an expensive suit summons a WOTC person to his office and demands that the WOTC person justifies the existence of D&D. Under TSR, GG and friends were probably happy with a steady wage doing what they love. Hasbro has to make sure that there is a return on investment that justifies the expense and risk. Keep in mind that money has alternative uses. Every dollar spent on D&D is a dollar that is not spent on My Little Poney, Transformers, GI Joe or Monoply: The Joliet State Penitentiary Edition (try the cabbage rolls). So every dollar that WOTC spends is a dollar that someone in the D&D unit fought for with the promise that there will be a return on investment that approximates the return if it were spent on some other endeavor. But post-'80's D&D has been frustrating hard to monetize. That appalling train wreck of a film pretty much guarantees that no one is going to risk real money trying to build a film franchise. I guess they are trying a comic book but I can't really think of an example where D&D has expanded beyond its core audience, an audience that is so small as to be mostly irrelevant to a company like Hasbro. Maybe some of it is due to an anti-corporate sentiment that I have detected from a few people. Since my 401k, the 403bs of the teachers in my group and the pensions of union gamers are tied up in investments in corporations (where else does one invest, really?) some of us rather hope that corporate American manages to make some money here and there. Our retirements depend on it. Finally, (and my apologies to that one person who has managed to read all the way through) the opposition to the new-model CB are so regressive that I have trouble believing the are all in good faith. I mean, everying is moving to the "cloud." In fact the "cloud" has become an annoying marketing buzzword. Back in the day, NetWare pimping the fact that NDS lived in the cloud was cool. Now, I am waiting for Proctor and Gamble to start pimping tampons that provide feminine hygeine in the cloud. Of course WOTC is moving to this model. The whole freaking world is moving to this model. You really honestly and truelly expect that WOTC is going to start marketing a product saying, "'90's tech like you know and love. All the data residing comfortably on your computer." Give me a freaking break. Edit: Some spelling, though probably not enough. [/QUOTE]
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