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Message: <blockquote data-quote="maransreth" data-source="post: 480394" data-attributes="member: 4390">"Skillwise, the Bard also shows up the Adventurer, possessing a fairly wide array of skills and a greater number of skill points."Core Bard gets 4 skill points, whereas Adventurer gets 6. Bard and rogue get only 1 good save, this gets 2 OF YOUR CHOICE.Over the bard and rogue it gets greater weapon proficiencies and more feats.With the fighter, yes the fighter gets more attacks, due to a higher BAB, but at higher levels those attacks become more than useless against opponents with high AC (which they should be coming across).The Adventurers scores over the fighter with 2 saves, instead of 1 and way more skill points. The example you provide of the fighter adventurer shows that against fighter fighters it drops, yes, but barely and most people I know use enchanted mithril chain anyway due to its effectiveness so the more pluses on AX the better. It is the other abilities that the class gets as well as its "nearly" fighter that make it overpowered. There must be balance and this class doesn't have it.Yes it might not be as effective as other core classes, but it doesnt have to be and with the fact that it is so close to a number of classes proves that it is unbalamced. If it was close to one or 2 then I would say fine, but it is close to more than that and with the fact that it has a non restricted feat selection it can easily equal some classes, just not those with spellcasting facilities.What makes it unbalanced? Simple. 2 good saves of your choice, d8 HD, rogue BAB progression, 6 skill points, simple and martial WP and feats every 3 levels. Even without the feats every 3 levels it is unbalanced. All classes have their ups and downs. Fighters: good HD, BAB and weapons. Poor skills and 1 good save.Rogue: good skills, so-so BAB. 1 good save, so-so HD.Wizard: Poor BAB, poor HD, poor skills. Spells. (An adventurer who got the drop on a wizard or sorcerer could kill them very quickly, esp if ambush set up and they had no defensive spells ready or not the right ones).To make it more balanced, drop to 1 good save and d6 HD. That is an immediate. With that I would look at it closer and then see if it were balanced.</blockquote>

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