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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Tellerve" data-source="post: 4425457" data-attributes="member: 2412">I agree with your breakdown, although you have to have a DM set up a battlefield to allow that.  Some dungeons won't allow for that kind of movement.  And if you do have say spots of cover, and as you pointed out, creatures would see you move to that point and get hidden.  I think intelligent creatures would go investigate that area with a move action, get LOS, and then they could attack you.That's why I was favoring flanking when early on you don't have the ability to stay hidden while moving.  And while you quoted flavor text that I agree is a great way to play a rogue, I'll go ahead and quote this for you.Role: Striker. You dart in to attack, do massive damage,and then retreat to safety. You do best when teamedwith a defender to flank enemies.So, while you think that is playing a fighter, Wizards sees it as a fine example of a rogue striker hitting the creature where it hurts easily from round to round.  Will that make you a target?  Sure, as would being seen hiding and trying to flank.I think we are arguing the same point actually, as I have tended to agree with you, except I don't see as big an issue with flanking as you appear to for their role as a striker.In any case, the other question that this discussion has brought up to me is how Fleeting Ghost, Chameleon and Shadow Stride.  To me the two beginning ones essentially become Shadow Stride.  At first you can move with no penalty to the move action.  I'm not sure why it says to make a stealth check, but it was before the revised stealth rules.  In the revised rules you make one if you move more than 2 spaces.  This allows you to move your 6, or 5, or 7 and not take the -5 to your check.  But you need to be hidden (ie have concealment/cover) the whole time.  Some would/and do argue opposite that.  Chameleon allows you to move from hidden to another place of cover through places that don't have cover/concelament which would normally break your Hidden status.  However, as soon that hidden status would go away you get a stealth check and as long as you make it and get to cover/concealment you're still hidden.  Finally Shadow Stride just combines them so you can change the earlier utilities for something else as it allows full movement while hidden to a place of cover/concealment through non-concealed/covered areas.  That's when a rogue would really shine with the sneaky popin' in and out and sniping around the battlefield.cheers,Tellerve</blockquote>

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