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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Dausuul" data-source="post: 5490817" data-attributes="member: 58197">Of course they reserve the right to bring back the line if it becomes profitable again. But that doesn't come close to justifying a decision to build 5E around requiring minis. It's insane to lock yourself into heavy dependence on a business line that might maybe become profitable again, someday.If people buy more monster books when said books are in boxes, I fail to see why WotC needs any more justification than that to box 'em up. I rather doubt this is in fact the case.Eliminating? Who said anything about eliminating? People have been playing D&D with minis since before it was D&D. The question is how much the game depends on minis. AD&D could be played with minis and often was, but lots of groups played without, including most of the ones I was in. I've never seen anyone play 4E without minis and battlemat.As I said in a different thread: When miniatures are a big seller, miniatures dependence is a feature. When there's limited profit to be made on minis, that dependence is a bug. Right now, there's limited profit in minis and no particular reason to believe this is going to change any time soon.10-minute combats are quite easy in older editions if you're not using minis (if you are, the setup time puts a lower limit on how fast a fight can go). Of course, in many cases "roll d20 to kill a thing" is pretty close to what happens. When the magic-user got fireball, you could be rolling 5d6 to kill several things--no need to bother with a saving throw when the monster took twice its hit points in damage anyway.You can achieve a similar effect in 4E by pitting the party against an equal number of minions. The problem is, 5 minions against 5 PCs is utterly pathetic and doesn't come close to justifying the time required to set up minis and battlemat. If the minions were able to drain some resources before they died, and if the game ran smoothly without minis, I think it could be made to work.</blockquote>

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