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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Kerrick" data-source="post: 4501162" data-attributes="member: 4722">This is a new poison system I've been cobbling together. It's inspired by a couple things: first, I wanted to have diseases and poisons use the same ruleset; second, I've always thought that basing a poison's strength on the creature's Con score was ridiculous (some of the most venomous creatures on earth are also some of the smallest, like the golden dart frog); third, I wanted to have some kind of a set of guidelines for pricing and such.And so, I came up with some rules. I adapted a few things from an old netbook (no author) I found floating around the net a few years back and saved on the off-chance I'd find a use for it, and took the rest from the DMG and research into real-world poisons and venoms. In order to save space, anything that hasn't changed from the core rules (like the intro and method of delivery) hasn't been included here.[sblock]Strength Rating: Poisons are rated as Mild, Moderate, Strong, Deadly, and Epic.Mild poisons are usually found in common creatures – small snakes, large insects, some plants, etc. They are rarely lethal and usually have little effect on the average adventurer – a few points of ability damage or mild sickness at most.Moderate poisons are found in less common creatures, like (normal-sized) cobras, poisonous insects/arachnids (black widows or Small spiders), or less supernatural/weaker creatures from the Monster Manual like ettercaps and imps. It can be lethal to common folk (and even the occasional unlucky adventurer); effects vary - mild to serious ability damage, moderate paralysis (lasts several minutes to a few hours), or incapacitation.Strong poisons are fairly rare in nature – they belong to a small set of normal animals and some of the more fantastic creatures like weaker nagas, mid-level demons/devils, and couatl. Their poison is often lethal, either from its effects alone or from victims failing enough saves before they successfully recover.Deadly poisons are the most powerful type found in nature. Most creatures with deadly poison aren't natural at all – powerful demons/devils or other outsiders, supernatural beings like nightcrawlers, or extremely large creatures like purple worms. Natural creatures with deadly poison should be rare in the extreme, but they can exist (there is an example of such in the real world – the golden dart frog; 1 gram of its poison can kill up to 15,000 humans).Epic poisons are never found in nature – only gods, demon lords, archdevils, and beings of similar status produce poison of this magnitude.Type: Poisons are divided into several broad categories: debilitating (reduces all ability scores by a set amount); hallucinogenic (more commonly referred to as mind-altering substances); incapacitating (deal Str and/or Dex damage by weakening the victim); neurotoxins (deal Con damage and usually result in death); paralytic; and soporific (sleep poisons).Debilitating poisons weaken a victim for a period of time depending on strength (from hours to days). All physical ability scores are reduced by the appropriate modifier (see Damage and Other Effects, below) during this time. This result occurs as a secondary effect. The primary effect is the penalty for a poison one level lower, which lasts until the victim shakes off the effects or fails the requisite number of saves. For example, a moderate debilitating poison incurs a -2 penalty as a primary effect. They can be of any strength.Hallucinogenic poisons are always artificial, though some types can be distilled from plants. They induce hallucinations, visions, and/or nightmares (either waking visions, or they place the victim into a nightmare-filled sleep or coma).Incapacitating poisons are designed to cripple, but not necessarily kill, the victim, much like paralytics. Stronger incapacitating poisons often have lasting damage (noted as ability drain) even if the victim recovers.Neurotoxins affect the nervous system, causing spasms, loss of coordination, partial paralysis, convulsions, coma, and death. They are almost always lethal, and never less than Moderate strength. Common neurotoxins include snake venom, frog poison, and marine life venoms (tetrodotoxin, like that produced by the pufferfish and the blue ring octopus, is a form of neurotoxin).Paralytic poisons leave a victim unable to move for a period of time. The victim suffers no other ill effects from the poison, but their condition can lead to quite a few problems for any companions. The primary effect of a paralytic poison is that the victim is slowed. Total paralysis occurs as a secondary effect. Paralytics can be of any strength; the stronger the poison, the longer the effect lasts.Soporific poisons induce waves of weakness and lassitude. Victims move at half speed and suffer a -2 penalty to AC and attack rolls the round after being struck, which lasts until they are cured, fight off the effects, or succumb to the poison. A good example of a soporific is drow sleep poison. Soporifics are generally mild to moderate in strength; as with paralytics, stronger poisons have longer-lasting effects.Save DCs: A victim who has been poisoned must make a Fort save at a given DC (noted below). If he fails that save, he must succeed at a certain number of saves (not consecutive) before he fails a certain number (also noted below). If the victim reaches the number of failures first, he suffers the secondary effect. Mild: Up to 13; 2/5Moderate: 14-18; 3/6Strong: 19-25; 3/5Deadly: 26-34; 4/5Epic: 35+; 5/5  As noted above for strength ratings, the DCs are rough guidelines - feel free to adjust natural poison DCs by 1-2 points in either direction - or even reduce the number of successful saves required - if you think the PCs might have too easy or hard a time making their saves. Real world poisons don't always have the same effect, even from the same creature and the same target – the creature's bite or sting could be less than fully effective, or it could inject more or less poison each time. Between different victims, you also have resistances and simple luck playing factors.  For artificial poisons, you can adjust the DC by up to 4 points in either direction – this simulates the poisoner delivering a larger or smaller dose, or the target ingesting, inhaling, etc. a larger or smaller dose.Onset time: Venoms or poisons produced by creatures generally have a short onset time. Artificial poisons can be variable.  Immediate poisons, despite the title, activate up to 1 minute after the poison is applied. Most monster poisons fall into this category. Generally, the onset time depends on the strength: Mild 1d8 rounds; Moderate 1d6 rounds; Strong 1d4 rounds; Deadly 1d2 rounds; Epic 1 round.  Delayed poisons activate after 2d6-1 minutes. Most plant poisons fall into this category.  Slow poisons activate after 2d6-1 hours.   Dormant poisons activate after 2d6-1 days.   Binary and Trinary poisons activate only after the subsequent introduction of a triggering agent, and often have a delayed onset time to allay suspicion (e.g., the first part is in the sweetmeats shared by everyone except the poisoner, the second part is in the wine shared by the victims and their poisoner. Separately the parts are harmless, but together…).  Check: As with saves, the check interval (the amount of time between saves) is based on the poison's strength – Mild: 5d6 minutes; Moderate: 3d6 minutes; Strong: 4d10 rounds; Deadly: 3d6 rounds; Epic: 1d4 rounds.  As with save DCs, you can adjust the onset time upwards or downwards as you feel necessary, either to give the victim's companions time to heal him, or to ratchet up the suspense. At no time before they start to show symptoms, however, should PCs know that they have been poisoned – they should never know the results of their save unless it's a natural 20 or a natural 1.  Effect: Poisons can have a number of effects, based on their type. Incapacitating poisons, neurotoxins, and hallucinogens deal ability damage/drain, as noted on the table below (in general, incapacitating poisons deal Strength and/or Dex damage, neurotoxins deal Con damage, and hallucinogens deal Wis or Cha damage).  Other effects are noted on the table below.[code]Type                 Mild    Moderate    Strong              Deadly    EpicAbility damage(1)  1-3                 3-6    6-10           10-12        12+Debilitating    -2, 2d6 hours    -4, 4d6 hours    -6, 1d4 days    -8, 2d4 days    -10, 3d6 daysParalytic    1d4 hours    2d6 hours    4d6 hours    6d6 hours    1d3 daysSoporific    1d4 hours    1d6 hours    2d4 hours    3d6 hours    4d10 hours[/code](1) Average damage per failed save. This encompasses all poisons that deal ability damage, including hallucinogens, incapacitating poisons, and neurotoxins. These usually have secondary effects which are stronger than the primary effects: [code]Type    Mild    Moderate    Strong    Deadly    EpicHallucinogenic    1-2    3-5    6-8    Coma1    Coma(1)Incapacitating    1-3    4-6    7-10    Reduce to 0(2)    Reduce to 0(2)Neurotoxin    --    1-6    7-12    Death    Death[/code](1) The victim's Wis or Cha score (whichever the poison affects) is reduced to 0, and the victim drops into a coma.(2) The victim's Str or Dex score is reduced to 0.  One point of ability drain is treated as three points of ability damage.   Natural poisons (those produced by plants and creatures) almost always have a primary effect that's one lower than the save DC (it can be the same as the DC), and a secondary effect that's the same as the DC (one higher than the primary effect). For example, a couatl's poison deals 2d4 primary Strength damage (average 5 points), and 4d4 secondary damage (average 10 points).  Artificial poisons, however, don't always follow the above guidelines -  someone can create a poison that's very hard to resist, but only does a small amount of damage over time, or vice versa. The save and effects cannot be more than two categories apart, however – for example, a poison could have a Mild DC and do Strong damage.[/sblock]That's the gist of it. If you want to see a better-organized and more complete version of all this (with proper tables), I've also attached the file. I haven't gone over the DMG poisons yet; I mainly got it done so I could work on the monsters - the others will come later. A sample poison entry would look something like this:(Bebelith) Poison: Injury; strong neurotoxin; DC 18, onset 1d3 rounds; check 4d8 rounds; initial effect 2d4 Con damage, secondary effect 2d6 Con damage.As you can see, the above listing doesn't adhere exactly to the guidelines - I deliberately left some latitude so DMs could play around a bit, make some poisons faster-acting or deal less damage, frex.</blockquote>

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