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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Charlaquin" data-source="post: 9423742" data-attributes="member: 6779196">The invisible condition is the entirety of the effect granted the invisibility spell, so unless the condition is one ring style invisibility, the spell doesn’t grant one ring style invisibility.If the game effect is the same, then either the game effect of being in pitch darkness or successfully hiding yourself behind intervening terrain must include remaining unseen when someone illuminates the darkness with a torch or moves so that the terrain no longer intervenes from their perspective, or the game effect of having the invisibility spell cast on you must not include being unseen while illuminated and not behind intervening terrain. Either interpretation is unacceptable to me.No, it isn’t. The 2014 rules account for being unseen and undetected separately (though admittedly it’s phrased awkwardly); hiding grants the latter under the condition of the former but does not grant the former on its own, so you need suitable cover or concealment to prevent you from being seen, and invisiblity grants you the former at all times while the spell lasts but does not inherently grant the latter, though it makes the latter much easier to gain by hiding, since you no longer need cover or concealment.Again, that’s a reasonable interpretation, except that it would mean the invisibility spell, which only grants the invisible condition, must also only grant this mechanical effect and not actual invisibility.That’s not the worst. The worst is a situation where the PC goes somewhere there are no enemies around and repeatedly rolls stealth checks until they get a 15 plus, and then walks straight through a maximum security area (describing themselves being super, super quiet about it, of course!) completely undetected. Or, if you favor the “the invisible condition isn’t actual invisibility” interpretation, the worst is a situation where the player casts the invisibility spell and tries to sneak through a maximum security area, only to be told, “sorry, the spell doesn’t actually make you invisible, it just gives you advantage on attacks and initiative rolls.”</blockquote>

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