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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Charlaquin" data-source="post: 9428884" data-attributes="member: 6779196"><p>Obviously players doing silly things like that isn’t going to be a real problem in play. But what might be a real problem in play is players and DMs having different opinions about how obvious the thing the character is doing should be to the enemies. This rule provides no default way to determine if an enemy should spot a PC, short of a successful Perception check, so any time a DM thinks a players character should be spotted without need for a check, they must use fiat to rule as much. This puts the DM in the position of always needing to rule more restrictively than the book, which is a recipe for hard feelings, and hard feelings are not something I think the rules should set groups up to have to deal with. The PC mooning the enemies while “invisible” is not meant to be a serious example of something that would realistically happen in play, but as a point of commonality - something we can all agree the rules should not allow, yet the rules as written don’t provide a clear mechanism to prevent. From that point of common ground, we can imagine incrementally less egregious examples of cases where the DM might reasonably think the PC should be spotted, but the rules as written still don’t provide a mechanism for the DM to rule that they are, other than fiat, which may cause the player to feel unfairly treated.</p></blockquote><p></p>