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General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
New to 4ed. : what do i have to know/look out for?
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<blockquote data-quote="pemerton" data-source="post: 6925291" data-attributes="member: 42582"><p>Always happy to spruik my own stuff!</p><p></p><p>And to talk about play techniques.</p><p></p><p>There is a recurring discussion on these boards, that has generated multiple threads over the years, as to how to adjudicate failure (especially failed skill checks): does the failure have to correspond to the PC doing something wrong or making a mistake? or can the failure be narrated in terms of some external factor intervening to get in the way of the PC getting what s/he wants?</p><p></p><p>I think 4e works better if the GM is ready to take the second approach - when a check is failed (especially in a skill challenge), use that as an opportunity to introduce some new obstacle or complication or challenge that fits into the current story, but pushes things in a new (and, from the PC/player point of view, adverse) direction.</p><p></p><p>A much-discussed couple of examples that [MENTION=6696971]Manbearcat[/MENTION] has talked about are: (i) the PC is riding away from the goblins having stolen their sacred idol, and the player rolls and fails a Nature check - the PC suddenly comes to a wide gorge in his/her path, and has to choose either to try and jump it, or find some other mode of escape, or turn and confront the pursuing goblins; (ii) the PC is climbing a mountain to find the treasure at the top of it, carrying a magical divining rod that will let him/her find the treasure at the top of the mountain, and the player rolls and fails an Athletics check - the divining rod comes loose and falls down a ravine, so that now the PC has to choose whether to make it to the top of the mountain on time but with no divining rod, or to try and retrieve the rod from the ravine but risk letting his/her enemies get to the top of the mountain first.</p><p></p><p>Like some other posters in this thread have already said, 4e works best when you push it in this sort of action movie direction, rather than focusing on minutiae. And the depth of player resources (powers, healing surges, action points, etc) means that when you wield your power as GM to introduce these new complications in response to failure, your players have what they need to push back on behalf of their PCs. There's no need for GM fudging or softballing like in some other RPGs.</p><p></p><p>I haven't used them much as a GM, but my players have used plenty of stuff from them for PC building.</p><p></p><p>Generally, the magazine stuff doesn't seem to raise any balance issues.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="pemerton, post: 6925291, member: 42582"] Always happy to spruik my own stuff! And to talk about play techniques. There is a recurring discussion on these boards, that has generated multiple threads over the years, as to how to adjudicate failure (especially failed skill checks): does the failure have to correspond to the PC doing something wrong or making a mistake? or can the failure be narrated in terms of some external factor intervening to get in the way of the PC getting what s/he wants? I think 4e works better if the GM is ready to take the second approach - when a check is failed (especially in a skill challenge), use that as an opportunity to introduce some new obstacle or complication or challenge that fits into the current story, but pushes things in a new (and, from the PC/player point of view, adverse) direction. A much-discussed couple of examples that [MENTION=6696971]Manbearcat[/MENTION] has talked about are: (i) the PC is riding away from the goblins having stolen their sacred idol, and the player rolls and fails a Nature check - the PC suddenly comes to a wide gorge in his/her path, and has to choose either to try and jump it, or find some other mode of escape, or turn and confront the pursuing goblins; (ii) the PC is climbing a mountain to find the treasure at the top of it, carrying a magical divining rod that will let him/her find the treasure at the top of the mountain, and the player rolls and fails an Athletics check - the divining rod comes loose and falls down a ravine, so that now the PC has to choose whether to make it to the top of the mountain on time but with no divining rod, or to try and retrieve the rod from the ravine but risk letting his/her enemies get to the top of the mountain first. Like some other posters in this thread have already said, 4e works best when you push it in this sort of action movie direction, rather than focusing on minutiae. And the depth of player resources (powers, healing surges, action points, etc) means that when you wield your power as GM to introduce these new complications in response to failure, your players have what they need to push back on behalf of their PCs. There's no need for GM fudging or softballing like in some other RPGs. I haven't used them much as a GM, but my players have used plenty of stuff from them for PC building. Generally, the magazine stuff doesn't seem to raise any balance issues. [/QUOTE]
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