Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Next
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
Twitch
YouTube
Facebook (EN Publishing)
Facebook (EN World)
Twitter
Instagram
TikTok
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
New Wild Shape
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Chaosmancer" data-source="post: 8949996" data-attributes="member: 6801228"><p>Actually, as a person who played a Dream Druid, I disagree. Wildshape had massive utility outside of combat, and since it was an action to transform, it was rarely used in combat. It had two major points though. </p><p></p><p>1) Becoming tiny to scout was AMAZING. It gave the Druid a lot of flexibility and fun, flavorful things they could do. I particularly enjoyed becoming a spider to fit through cracks and sneak ahead, or becoming a giant snake to move through the swamp. I once became a Jaguar to hunt a scent as well.</p><p></p><p>2) You could (at a point) become Large, and that had some limited utility as well. I had a player who became a horse and was able to carry an unconcious party member. </p><p></p><p>Now? The Large utility still exists, but the major use I had for Wildshape is gone. You can still bloodhound with it, but you can't use it to scout ahead. The smallest you can be is small, which is a normal dog size or a baboon. Looking at the MM list? Most animals were tiny, cats, badgers, snakes, hawks, lizards. By moving tiny to 11th and cutting it down to 10 minutes, they've gutted the biggest and most common use for the ability.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>The problem for me is that we keep trying to make it a combat ability. It is for Moon druids, but for every single other type of Druid, Wildshape was not a good combat move. Because of the Action economy. But now? Now they are forcing it to be a combat tool, because of the level 5 multi-attack. But they are still making it an action. </p><p></p><p>And that will never work. Just look at the Devotion Paladin, they changed the blessed weapon channel divinity because no one used an action at the start of combat to activate it. Rage would be terrible if it took an action to activate. Ect Ect ECt. </p><p></p><p>Additionally, my Dream Druid did end up fighthing in Giant Snake form... and I really found myself wishing the enemy would go ahead and knock me out of it so I could be more effective. I'd gone from 18 AC to 12 AC, from dealing 13 damage at-will to 5 damage at-will, from a +7 to hit, to a +4 to hit. In every conceivable way, it was worse than just being myself. But I didn't want to waste the wildshape until it was used up, because hey, 13 extra hp was decent. But the enemy didn't even bother attacking me, because I wasn't enough of a threat to warrant attacking. </p><p></p><p>Treating Wildshape like a combat option is, I think, a mistake. Unless you are willing to make the Moon Druid's bonus action shift universal. </p><p></p><p></p><p>Also, side note, your suggesting for Temp HP MAXES at 9, and knocks them out of the shape when they lose it? You do realize that if you want a 12th level Druid to use wildshape in combat, you are asking them to use their action to gain 9 temp hp, lose their AC, and then basically immediately lose the form when they get hit because NOTHING at that level is going to hit them for less than 9 damage. It is an utter waste of time,</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Chaosmancer, post: 8949996, member: 6801228"] Actually, as a person who played a Dream Druid, I disagree. Wildshape had massive utility outside of combat, and since it was an action to transform, it was rarely used in combat. It had two major points though. 1) Becoming tiny to scout was AMAZING. It gave the Druid a lot of flexibility and fun, flavorful things they could do. I particularly enjoyed becoming a spider to fit through cracks and sneak ahead, or becoming a giant snake to move through the swamp. I once became a Jaguar to hunt a scent as well. 2) You could (at a point) become Large, and that had some limited utility as well. I had a player who became a horse and was able to carry an unconcious party member. Now? The Large utility still exists, but the major use I had for Wildshape is gone. You can still bloodhound with it, but you can't use it to scout ahead. The smallest you can be is small, which is a normal dog size or a baboon. Looking at the MM list? Most animals were tiny, cats, badgers, snakes, hawks, lizards. By moving tiny to 11th and cutting it down to 10 minutes, they've gutted the biggest and most common use for the ability. The problem for me is that we keep trying to make it a combat ability. It is for Moon druids, but for every single other type of Druid, Wildshape was not a good combat move. Because of the Action economy. But now? Now they are forcing it to be a combat tool, because of the level 5 multi-attack. But they are still making it an action. And that will never work. Just look at the Devotion Paladin, they changed the blessed weapon channel divinity because no one used an action at the start of combat to activate it. Rage would be terrible if it took an action to activate. Ect Ect ECt. Additionally, my Dream Druid did end up fighthing in Giant Snake form... and I really found myself wishing the enemy would go ahead and knock me out of it so I could be more effective. I'd gone from 18 AC to 12 AC, from dealing 13 damage at-will to 5 damage at-will, from a +7 to hit, to a +4 to hit. In every conceivable way, it was worse than just being myself. But I didn't want to waste the wildshape until it was used up, because hey, 13 extra hp was decent. But the enemy didn't even bother attacking me, because I wasn't enough of a threat to warrant attacking. Treating Wildshape like a combat option is, I think, a mistake. Unless you are willing to make the Moon Druid's bonus action shift universal. Also, side note, your suggesting for Temp HP MAXES at 9, and knocks them out of the shape when they lose it? You do realize that if you want a 12th level Druid to use wildshape in combat, you are asking them to use their action to gain 9 temp hp, lose their AC, and then basically immediately lose the form when they get hit because NOTHING at that level is going to hit them for less than 9 damage. It is an utter waste of time, [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
New Wild Shape
Top