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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Valdrax" data-source="post: 4229936" data-attributes="member: 56320">Let's talk about these two points.The first point is only relevant if you believe that you have to be 100% true to a component of your alignment to hold to it.  This is the kind of thing that gives us Lawful Stupid Paladins who act like morality robots instead of realistic characters.  Let me ask a counter question:  If a Paladin meets a run-away slave, should he obey the Law and return him to the master who will likely beat, maim, and/or kill him, or should be obey Good and try to avoid seeing harm come to the slave?  Either answer you give will cause the Paladin to violate one component of his alignment.  Does that mean that he no longer qualfites to be Lawful Good because this situation was presented to him, or does the general thrust of one's morality extend beyond minor transgressions in the greater name of it?In other words, if conquering or war or summary executions of political rivals are non-Lawful, then does that negate the entire thrust of LE just because Evil was served over Law temporarily?As for the second question, I would argue in fact that the willing cogs in the evil bureaucracy are the most LE elements of it.  These are the people who commit atrocities because they are "just following orders" or otherwise "team players."  These are your concentration camp guards, your vice presidents and middle managers who cover up the toxic products, your Inquisition torturers, your adjusters who look for any excuse to prevent a sick and dying person from claiming any insurance money so they can claim a bonus at the end of the month, etc.  These are people who either knowingly or callously inflict suffering on others because the system demands it or even just allows for it.The Black Knight or Honorable Overlord are merely two of many LE archetypes.  Two factors that are important in considering L&C Ethics (as opposed from purely "How Evil are you?" questions like whether you'd molest a child) are whether the rules are completely ironclad and whether the villain would give up significant advantage to follow them.For example, a bloodthirsty serial duelist/murderer who just wants a good fight might still be utterly honor-bound when it comes to the rules of the duel and yet still Evil enough to constantly sacrifice the lives of the less skilled in search of a thrilling fight.  Whether such a character would be NE or LE would largely depend on other aspects of the personality beyond that, but a character that absolutely refused to, say, murder someone outside of a duel or kill an unarmed opponent would almost certainly not qualify as CE.Depends on the person.  Think of the Ford executives who decided not to recall the Pinto because they figured that it would be cheaper to settle with the victims or just pay the compensatory damages if they went all the way to court (forgetting completely about the punitive damages).  I can't say I know them personally, but they were certainly following all the laws of a non-Evil society and yet still being pretty LE in action.Meh.  That has nothing to do with Chaos and everything to do with Evil.  Name one line that a CE character will cross that a NE character won't.</blockquote>

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