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<blockquote data-quote="Guest 6801328" data-source="post: 7333411"><p>Wow, I'm falling behind on this thread....</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>My first answer is: "You don't." You focus on finishing the adventure, and then for levels 11 to 20 you can take your time and figure out how to spend your gold.</p><p></p><p>My real answer is: if you need to fall back on the plot of just <em>one</em> of the published adventures to defend your position, you may want to re-think your argument.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>But that's a totally artificial constraint. Downtime exists. If you don't use it in your game that's not really a valid basis for complaining about other rules. It reminds me of the Warlord debate:</p><p></p><p>"Warlords need to heal because all other healing is magical."</p><p>"But...but...it's a game about worlds that have magic."</p><p>"Yeah but we don't use magic in our game."</p><p>"..." </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I'm confused how the discussion shifted from magic shops (or at least non-random availability of magic items to buy, at prices that 'make sense' according to an imagined market....which itself is totally subjective) to "magic items should feel special". Why is it WotC's job to make magic items feel special? Is it WotC's job to make every Orc unique and memorable? If you, as a DM or player, cannot make up some fluff to make a +1 sword feel unique, I think you are playing the wrong game.</p><p></p><p>Furthermore, an example of how "broken" rarity pricing is is that a Vicious Weapon is more rare than the mathematically superior +1 Sword. Well...isn't that exactly what you are asking for? The Vicious Weapon is more "special" in the way you are describing, thus it costs more. WTF are you actually asking for? </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>(Ironically, I believe @<em><strong><u><a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/member.php?u=23751" target="_blank">Maxperson</a></u></strong></em> does in fact expect them to be surprised, based on opinions he has expressed in threads about metagaming.)</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I just want to point out that you keep citing support for buying weapons in previous editions as evidence that WotC is obligated (because of their "promise" to support all playing styles) to continue doing so. But you also claim that previous attempts were poorly done and illogical.</p><p></p><p>Since the current version is <em>also</em> poorly done and illogical (by your assessment) haven't they met their obligation to provide you the same experience you are used to?</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I have to say, of all the arguments for magic shops, this one you keep harping on ("they give you money, so they should be giving you something to spend it on, and I'm going to keep narrowing the parameters until nothing qualifies except magic items") is the least persuasive. So unpersuasive, in fact, that although I started off the thread opposed to magic shops I actually find myself <em>more</em> opposed 26 pages later.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Guest 6801328, post: 7333411"] Wow, I'm falling behind on this thread.... My first answer is: "You don't." You focus on finishing the adventure, and then for levels 11 to 20 you can take your time and figure out how to spend your gold. My real answer is: if you need to fall back on the plot of just [I]one[/I] of the published adventures to defend your position, you may want to re-think your argument. But that's a totally artificial constraint. Downtime exists. If you don't use it in your game that's not really a valid basis for complaining about other rules. It reminds me of the Warlord debate: "Warlords need to heal because all other healing is magical." "But...but...it's a game about worlds that have magic." "Yeah but we don't use magic in our game." "..." I'm confused how the discussion shifted from magic shops (or at least non-random availability of magic items to buy, at prices that 'make sense' according to an imagined market....which itself is totally subjective) to "magic items should feel special". Why is it WotC's job to make magic items feel special? Is it WotC's job to make every Orc unique and memorable? If you, as a DM or player, cannot make up some fluff to make a +1 sword feel unique, I think you are playing the wrong game. Furthermore, an example of how "broken" rarity pricing is is that a Vicious Weapon is more rare than the mathematically superior +1 Sword. Well...isn't that exactly what you are asking for? The Vicious Weapon is more "special" in the way you are describing, thus it costs more. WTF are you actually asking for? (Ironically, I believe @[I][B][U][URL="http://www.enworld.org/forum/member.php?u=23751"]Maxperson[/URL][/U][/B][/I] does in fact expect them to be surprised, based on opinions he has expressed in threads about metagaming.) I just want to point out that you keep citing support for buying weapons in previous editions as evidence that WotC is obligated (because of their "promise" to support all playing styles) to continue doing so. But you also claim that previous attempts were poorly done and illogical. Since the current version is [I]also[/I] poorly done and illogical (by your assessment) haven't they met their obligation to provide you the same experience you are used to? I have to say, of all the arguments for magic shops, this one you keep harping on ("they give you money, so they should be giving you something to spend it on, and I'm going to keep narrowing the parameters until nothing qualifies except magic items") is the least persuasive. So unpersuasive, in fact, that although I started off the thread opposed to magic shops I actually find myself [I]more[/I] opposed 26 pages later. [/QUOTE]
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