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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Goonalan" data-source="post: 5752738" data-attributes="member: 16069">I kinda do this already, forex I played through KOTS with a bunch of noobs not so long ago- I've DM'ed KOTS quite a few times now, and so-When they wandered into the caves section (which serves no real purpose) I made it clear that this was a place that the Goblins don't go, when they found the secret chamber there I made it doubly clear that this was a 'safe hidden' place.Same goes for the Hidden Armory which was behind a secret door.The point being the players grasped the idea that they had a bolt-hole in which they could 'probably' take an extended rest undiscovered.The reason I did this is because if they decided to drop anchor just anywhere in the dungeon then I was going to bring the bad guys to them- as I've done with previous KOTS wanderers in the past.The threat needs to be active, finding somewhere to get in an extended rest should be difficult to achieve, but in 4e, not impossible.Lastly should they vacate the dungeon and head for home then as stated previously the bad guys make ready for their return, or else abandon the lair.As it happens with the newbs they got the hints that the caves were safe but decided to clear the area out before taking an extended rest- alas two of them (including the Cleric) died in the attempt. Admittedly they were on their seventh encounter of the day, low on Surges, but still in a very heroic frame of mind.I think their having a safe place to retreat to actually encouraged them to keep going till they were out of resources. They loved it by the way, and learnt (slightly) from their mistake. Although they are actually in the process of repeating it in TL at the moment, in the Horned Hold, they've just finished their 6th encounter in a row and are pushing on with a max of 2 Healing Surges left/PC and most Dailies spent. However this is because the room set aside in the dungeon for the players extended rest (the Ruined Shrine) so terrified them they turned tail (after a close run thing with the Wights) and instead decided that plowing through the Duergar was far preferable than resting up- they hate Wights now (they lost 2-3 Surges each in the fight before they got in a Short Rest and had to spend more).Keep 'em on their toes, that's what I say.</blockquote>

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