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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Rechan" data-source="post: 5753245" data-attributes="member: 54846">If some groups have 15-minute work days and others don't, why are the ones who don't criticizing suggested solutions for those who do? It exists for some groups, and it exists for multiple reasons, not just for lazy DMs.Many of the solutions from the Don't crowd is very situational. Reactive dungeons and wandering monsters only work for Some places, not others. PCs taking a rest while trying to forcibly breach a fort should be laughed off the table. However, if you have a large cave complex that has 3 factions in it - the kobolds, the orcs, and a big bad minotaur - then unless the 3 factions interact on a daily (if not hourly) basis, then if PCs come in and wipe out the orcs, the other two factions have little reason to be suspicious (sounds of fighting and shouting is common among the orcs, sounds may move funny in caves, etc)*. And because the complex is firmly established by the three factions, there's little reason why they would allow independent monsters to wander through since that would be a threat to any of the dungeon's residents (you wouldn't let a bear routinely wander through your neighborhood, would you?). Thus the PCs, based on verisimilitude, would be safe to camp in the Orc section after clearing it out.The reactive dungeon also assumes certain responses from the dungeon residents. It assumes that the Residents think the assailants are still in the dungeon, that the PCs are going to wipe out the rest of the residents, and that the rest of the residents should take offensive measures. Using the above example, the kobolds if they were alerted could easily just increase their own defenses for a time, battening down the hatches, rather than try to defend the Orcs' lost territory or patrol it - later they will loot resources/food/etc from the dead orcs' tunnels. The minotaur might assume that the assailants were coming for the orcs and, while he may be on the lookout for intruders, likely doesn't care for the fate of the orcs. Neither group scours the destroyed territory, thus neither group would stumble upon the camping PCs.The other problem with "Ok well the dungeon responds" is that if the dungeon responds while the PCs rest, they're likely to battle without recovering their daily resources, face overwhelming odds, and die. So the DM has to decide if he wants to kill the party to teach them to stop resting. The problem with "Well the party should face non-max challenging odds" was responded well by NewJeffCT - in a game where a combat can take an hour, spending an hour fighting a non-challenging fight when you may not play all that often is a waste of time. KM's suggestion is fine for the same reason that dungeons often do have empty rooms. The campsites are empty rooms or points that are easily defended/out of the way. However, D&D is a game of resource management. And taking some of the resource management out of the players' hands will likely be problematic**.But I think the best method would be a three-pronged approach. KM's method (WHEN APPROPRIATE), the Reactive dungeon (WHEN APPROPRIATE), and the DM talking to the players. Because trying to curb bothersome Player behavior in-game without addressing it out of game is a recipe for frustration. A DM could simply say "Guys, I don't like you just resting. Could you try resisting the urge to blow all of your resources the first chance you get."*And honestly, in a reactive dungeon, why don't some enemies run away? Most intruders aren't coming in to slaughter everyone so they can live there, they're either looting or just slaughtering. A smart monster would see that his more-than-martially-comptent neighbor the orcs just got slaughtered, pack up his stuff and take a few days vacation, then checking back to see if the coast is clear later.**Again this depends on the group. I would be OK with a DM letting us know when/where we can rest and when we can't, when we're in hostile territory. But then I prefer very loosey-goosey styles, and don't like the 15 minute work day.</blockquote>

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