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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Jhaelen" data-source="post: 4993429" data-attributes="member: 46713">No, I'm not. It's something I explicitly pointed out in my first post in this thread:Nope. Unless I am mistaken, there are several ways to become immune to fear effects in 4E, as well. I'm thinking of paragon path abilities and (maybe) some items. I'd have to check my books to give concrete examples.It's true, you'll eventually have to take a feat in 4e if you don't like your worst defense to fall behind even more. But as I mentioned before, it's not something every player will care about.This! I think, 4E math isn't broken regarding NADs because they're expected to be hit more often. The effects generally aren't as severe as failing a save was back in 3E.E.g., in 3E a mind flayer's (at-will) mind blast would stun you for, what?, 3-12 rounds? Now, you're either stunned (save ends) or (paradoxically) worse: until the monster's next turn. Which leads me to something I think is missing in 4E: There are still very few ways to protect from or get rid of particular conditions. Most powers/items will grant extra saves or even automatically remove effects that a save can end, but there's too few ways to protect you if no save is involved.Anyway, thanks to everyone pointing out the differences between 4E non-AC defenses and the saving throws in earlier editions!Thinking back, I also agree that in 1e and 2e you needed to save a lot less often than in 3e. In 4e NADs will probably be targeted (at least at some point) every encounter. That's a pretty significant difference.</blockquote>

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