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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Nyeshet" data-source="post: 3589403" data-attributes="member: 18363">"But only when he makes a pun!" was the first thing that came to mind when I read this one. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /><a href="http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0390.html" target="_blank">http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0390.html</a>It is weaker than - or at best about the same in weakness as - the typical bard. Consider what you lose without spellcasting: arcane healing, break enchantment, various illusions and enchantments not available through bardic music, and several other useful spells besides. Don't forget also that with spell casting a bard can use a feat to take Craft Wondrous Items or Craft Magical Arms and Armor: for one feat they gain access to quite a few magical items. Craft Wands or Craft Scroll can increase the casting for the day greatly - even if its just a Craft Wand of Cure Light Wounds it can be phenomenally useful. Beyond about 10th to 12th level casting begins to eclipse non-casting in terms of power. By having casting at all the bard is - although not able to keep up with pure casters, at least able to keep up or almost keep up with non-casters. Removing casting and you have to significantly empower the bard to keep up at all. I'd suggest new songs - perhaps one or two a level, covering the major bases of enchantment, illusion, abjuration, and divination - perhaps with a bit of minor conjuring thrown in (although shadow based illusion go a long way towards dealing with conjuration, I admit, and are better in theme with the bard). Hmm, I might treat it as a variant warlock having many more invocations at the expense of no eldritch blast and requiring to use music to cast invocations. Change the specials that warlock gets for the bardic specials you have already mentioned, the d8 HD, two good saves, and simple weapon proficiency with light armor proficiency and one or two martial weapons (rapier, etc), and I think we may have a winner. The bard would have several songs that could be used at will for minor effects at first but notable ones at higher levels, enough hp and armor to last in a fight (at least as support), and enough skill pts and skill based specials to deal with most other situations the party may need. Hmm, give me a day or two and I'll post my view of this. It may not be balanced at first (although whether it is over or under powered is questionable), but with some work we should come to a balanced arrangement that might suit your needs.</blockquote>

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